Advice or opinions please - Ashdown ABM 600 EVO IV

[nosnowking]

Hi all,

I'm currently playing an old(ish) TC Electronic BH500 head which has served me well at many, many gigs over the last 4 years. I'm playing i through two K-212 cabs, which are nothing amazing but they have a deep, smooth sound which helps with the overall sound of the band, and is a nice, versatile configuration for various venues. We're playing a fair variety of songs (Uptown Funk, No One Knows, Hate To Say I Told You So, Get Lucky, Is This Love...you get the idea). We don't have a great PA, so the amp has to do all of the heavy lifting (as does my back...). 

I'm finding the rig has a big sound but is a bit flat and lacklustre. It does the overdriven wall-of-sound thing quite well, but lacks punch, dynamics and definition at times. I've tried the newer TC BH550 and 800 heads and have the same problem with them. Markbass isn't my thing, no matter how many times I want to like them.  Currently playing a Stingray, and also have a Jazz. Looking for a sound that's kinda middle-of-the-road...not too old school thump, but not too hi-fi either.

I'm toying with the idea of maybe an Ashdown ABM 600 EVO IV or a Gallien Krueger MB800. Any thoughts from people who've used these heads live? Any problems? Pros, cons? Any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance  

[Mudpup]

I've had a TC BG500 combo (same head as your amp i think), a GK MB500 Fusion (sort of similar to anMB800) and also an ABM600 evo4. And i play a Stingray too.

I too found the TC very bland sounding, sort of lifeless and a bit flat. I tried the newer BH heads too and thought they had a similar sort of sound so they weren't for me. But i liked a Staccato 51 head that i used at a festival recently - that had some wallop about it.

The Gallien was very good in an aggressive kind of way but i thought it fell into the class D trap of losing impact as you turned it up. Could get bloody loud but in a shouty fashion rather than trouser flapping. I've had a bunch of class D amps (inc MarkBass and Genz Benz) and found i cant get on with them at gig volumes because they lose their thump (until i discovered my Quilter BB800 - thats a whole different bag of fish!)

The Ashdown will blow the others into the weeds imho. It has a serious heft about it but can sparkle too and is a very versatile bit of kit - way better than other ABM's that i've tried which all seemed a bit mushy sounding. The trick with it is to use your ears to eq it rather than your eyes - don't be scared to crank the knobs and sliders and disengage the scoopy button. The valve drive adds a bit of fruit to the sound, i wasn't fussed about the compressor and i thought the sub thing wasn't much use in the real world. And it works great with a Stingray - it's a huge sounding combination. I moved it on for something different but i would cheerfully have another one......

Edited July 15, 2018 by Mudpup

[Lozz196]

I have the ABM 600 EVO IV and it`s the best amp I`ve ever had. Admittedly I get all my eq from my Para Driver but that`s due to me using many provided/shared rigs, but I can get the Para Driver sound from the ABM easily. It has power to spare, and with the compression, drive, and 9-band eq is probably the most flexible amp I`ve ever had. And as per @Mudpups post, when your on a big stage and have to turn it up it doesn`t get lost, the bulkiness and weight of the sound are still there. 

[la bam]

I recently bought a Evo iv ABM 600 and I have to say it is quality.

It's looking like it's going to take over as my first choice amp.

Firstly - power. Well, more than enough. Through my 6x10 it'll blow walls down.

Secondly - build quality. It's built like a tank. All quality. Leather, metal, stitching, components - all top notch. It's amazing how you forget how a good amp should feel and be built after dealing with lots of throwaway class d stuff.

Thirdly - Tone. What tone do you want? They're all in there! Granted they're not all that obvious to find, but theres some real lovely tones from classic Ashdown, to full on reggae, smooth funk and slamming ampeg style. The eq is second to none. You quickly learn what cutting out boosting a certain frequency does to shaping your sound. Some smooth it out, some add grit, some thickness, is a good learning curve.

Fourthly - in the mix. The amp really sits well in the mix. I've spent about a day looking for a tone I was after, then did some recording and it genuinely couldn't have mixed in better, and that's without any tweaking or adjusting.

Add to that great customer service, reliability and an amp that's built to last and you've got a great amp.

Edited July 17, 2018 by la bam

[Deedee]

On 15/07/2018 at 23:25, Mudpup said:

The trick with it is to use your ears to eq it rather than your eyes - don't be scared to crank the knobs and sliders 

Exactly this. I’ve been having a play with one of these over the past couple of days (I have an Orange 4-Stroke incoming too but, long story short, I saw a used ABM 600 at stupid money so thought I’d hedge my bets and see which one I like best).

I’ve never known an amp that is so bass heavy! With everything flat it just sounds like mush. The fact that you have to ignore your eyes and just use your ears possibly explains the number of bass players I’ve seen using Ashdowns and sounding awful.

There are certainly great tones to be had, it’s just that the starting point is a little off-centre.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Deedee
Typo

[Lozz196]

It is a warm/bassy amp if used in a small environment. I find cutting the 100hz works well in smaller rooms/stages. But get it on a big stage and you really feel the benefit, no weedy sounds from the ABM600 on a big stage, just solid power.

[Deedee]

What I’m finding at the moment (again it’s early days) is that the way you set the EQ up for one bass varies hugely when switching to another. I’m used to regularly switching between a P and a Stingray pretty seamlessly, changing little more than the volume. With this I need to really cut the bass and push the treble right up to get a bright tone on the P but when I switch to the ‘ray I have to make wholesale changes to the EQ on the head to get it sounding anything like.

Am I missing something?

EDIT - See below

Edited January 2, 2019 by Deedee

[la bam]

Have you sussed out which way (in or out) the pre shape is activated? Seem to remember it's not the same as the other buttons? And (daft question) have you switched the eq button on?

[Deedee]

23 minutes ago, la bam said:

Have you sussed out which way (in or out) the pre shape is activated? Seem to remember it's not the same as the other buttons? And (daft question) have you switched the eq button on?

Yeah it’s in for flat/out for the pre-shape.

The EQ is on and certainly working. I may just be going from one extreme to the other and need to be a little more ‘delicate’ with the sliders in order to get a decent tone for both basses. They’re pretty sensitive and make a significant difference  with very little movement.

EDIT - Just to clarify I am liking this head, it's just that I have a very short attention span/little patience at the moment and I think I may be the only bass player in the village who has never used an Ashdown head before 

Edited January 2, 2019 by Deedee

[Deedee]

1 hour ago, Deedee said:

I may just be going from one extreme to the other and need to be a little more ‘delicate’ with the sliders in order to get a decent tone for both basses. They’re pretty sensitive and make a significant difference  with very little movement.

I was being too extreme with the slider movements. You do need to use your ears instead of your eyes, but you can make big changes with very subtle changes to the sliders to enable you to keep a tone that remains good for different basses.

Phew! I'm going for a lie down  

[Mudpup]

If you're using a Precision and a Stingray you've got 2 significantly different and characteristic basses - the P with the low mid push and the Ray with a big lower end and sizzly treble. It'll be hard to get a similar sound from both i think without big changes at the amp.

I remember with the Ray having to cut the bass dial back a fair bit, drop the 180hz a tiny bit (it took the honk out), push the 340hz a touch, crank the mid dial about 3/4 of the way up and push all 3 mid/treble slider a fair bit. The treble dial didn't seem to do much. Looked weird but sounded great. This was thru a couple of Barefaced cabs that work better over eq'ed anyway so it may be a bit much depending on your cabs. 

The Precision baked in sound seems to suit the amp with much more minimal eq. The low mid grind it has works really well with a flatter setting or even with the scoop engaged and a bit of bass roll off at the amp.  

And yes, just going up or down a couple of db on the sliders made a massive difference sound wise at each frequency - particularly those low mid ones.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mudpup

[Deedee]

It’s not so much trying to get a similar sound, they’re 2 different animals. It’s just that I’ve never experienced such a big difference between them in general tone when using other amps (and I’ve had plenty). Currently using through a BF Super Twin.

[Mudpup]

13 minutes ago, Deedee said:

It’s not so much trying to get a similar sound, they’re 2 different animals. It’s just that I’ve never experienced such a big difference between them in general tone when using other amps (and I’ve had plenty). Currently using through a BF Super Twin.

I know exactly what you mean..... it seems to really bring out the differences. 

[Deedee]

Many thanks for the advice @Mudpup, @la bam and @Lozz196.

Greatly appreciated. Everyday’s a school day 👨‍🎓

[Bob Lord]

I generally have to do nothing to the EQ section except pull down all 3 sliders to the left of the mid knob down by a tiny fraction (like 3mm), and have the bass knob anywhere between 9 o clock and noon. It brings out the sound I want from my different basses without having to do anything but tame the low end. Which I don't mind - would rather have slightly more bass by default than not enough tbh. The 'pre-shape' button on the EVO IV generally does enough for me.

I think the secret to avoiding heartache (for me personally) with a using a stingray and precision with it, is to accept that they're not really ever going to sound like anything but themselves, and I try to accentuate the differences, if anything, rather than EQ them to sound similar. If I want to tweak for the stingray, I'd rather do it on the bass's own EQ. The fact that the EVO IV seems to accentuate (or at least, not mask them) these differences is something I've noticed too - and I really like that. It doesn't seem to impose its own character on basses in the way an SVT or a GK might

While we're on about EVO IV's, one thing that I can't work out is what the compressor knob is actually doing - I know it's doing some compressing! I turn it left and right (and it generally sounds best to me at noon, regardless of what bass) and I can hear it doing something, but it's not clear what's going on... I'm sure it's not just a 'ratio' control. Any ideas guys??

 

Edited January 3, 2019 by Bob Lord

[Mudpup]

5 hours ago, Bob Lord said:

While we're on about EVO IV's, one thing that I can't work out is what the compressor knob is actually doing - I know it's doing some compressing! I turn it left and right (and it generally sounds best to me at noon, regardless of what bass) and I can hear it doing something, but it's not clear what's going on... I'm sure it's not just a 'ratio' control. Any ideas guys??

 

I always had it switched off as i didn't think it improved anything...

Edited January 3, 2019 by Mudpup

[Deedee]

1 minute ago, Mudpup said:

I always had it switched off as i didn't think it improved anything...

Me neither

[Sparky Mark]

If you haven't got one, download the ABM user instructions which gives full details of what the compressor is doing and how it is dependent on setting the input levels optimally. 

Edited January 4, 2019 by Sparky Mark
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[Woodinblack]

Noticed after reading this, they are on 25% off offer on RichTone

[Sparky Mark]

1 hour ago, Woodinblack said:

Noticed after reading this, they are on 25% off offer on RichTone

£479 for a genuine 600 watt RMS class AB power amp with footswitchable 12ax7 and solid state blendable pre amp, 9 band EQ with mid pre shape, variable compressor and octave down, mute switch plus more is a fantastic deal for the best to date ABM. 

The only issue with all the above is that to get your tone (which almost certainly is in there) with ABM heads requires spending time learning how all the features work and interact with each other. Because I own lightweight amps that I play basically flat ( and I'm lazy) my ABM600 hasn't made it to a gig yet but at rehearsals it has demonstrated to me its immense power and flexibility.

If I could only afford one amp I would be happy if it was an ABM600 evo iv; I'd just have to pull my socks up and learn how to use it properly. 

 

Edited January 4, 2019 by Sparky Mark
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[Deedee]

Mine is going to be up on the forum shortly. It’s just not for me I’m afraid 😟 

[Sparky Mark]

2 minutes ago, Deedee said:

Mine is going to be up on the forum shortly. It’s just not for me I’m afraid 😟 

That's interesting and begs the question of what you don't like about it?

[Deedee]

Just now, Sparky Mark said:

That's interesting and begs the question of what you don't like about it?

I'm set in my ways and realise that I'm spending time trying to make it sound like other kit that I already have 

[Sparky Mark]

2 minutes ago, Deedee said:

I'm set in my ways and realise that I'm spending time trying to make it sound like other kit that I already have 

Have you been able to use it with a band yet? I think this head really shows its strengths in the mix and can sound just average in isolation. 

[Sparky Mark]

13 minutes ago, Deedee said:

I'm set in my ways and realise that I'm spending time trying to make it sound like other kit that I already have 

I usually only gig with a single bass so once the amp is set I don't need to adjust other than for volume or room effects.

It's interesting that you comment earlier that this is the only head where you have to make major (other than input level?) adjustments between your pb and sr basses. I would see this as an indication that the ABM is giving a more accurate representation of both basses rather than imposing the amps sound. The one control that really needs to be set correctly is the pre shape button which I have off (pushed in).