SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 I'm after a midi controller for my laptop to control free VST synth plug ins etc. It's awkward to use the laptop keyboard. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) what's your budget? Do you just need a keyboard (how many octaves?) or do you want drum pads and/or rotary controls too? Edited May 17, 2018 by bartelby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 You might have slightly better luck if you move this to the 'Recording' forum, let me know and I can shift it if you want. Cheers Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, bartelby said: what's your budget? Do you just need a keyboard (how many octaves?) or do you want drum pads and/or rotary controls too? 2-3 octaves, was looking at m audio oxygen 49. looks alright. ideally under £100. between 100-150 quid. Edited May 17, 2018 by SH73 added to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 12 minutes ago, Sibob said: You might have slightly better luck if you move this to the 'Recording' forum, let me know and I can shift it if you want. Cheers Si no idea how to shift it. Thanks Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 1 hour ago, SH73 said: no idea how to shift it. Thanks Si Moved Si 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 I really recommend the Novation controllers! I have a Launchkey 49 that I picked up in an online dealing I love it! Lots and lots of assignable controls including drum pads for programming grooves but also knobs that can control say a mixer in a DAW or filters in synth VSTs etc. One thing I really love is the action of the keyboard itself. It knocked spots off a 'pro' synthesiser I had years ago! Finally, it will plug in to my iPad without the need for external power, meaning it and iPad become a very powerful standalone workstation! (Novation also have free apps specifically designed to work with Launchkey which are just superb to play with.) There are also 25 and 61 key models too depending on how much space you have! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 33 minutes ago, dood said: I really recommend the Novation controllers! I have a Launchkey 49 that I picked up in an online dealing I love it! Lots and lots of assignable controls including drum pads for programming grooves but also knobs that can control say a mixer in a DAW or filters in synth VSTs etc. One thing I really love is the action of the keyboard itself. It knocked spots off a 'pro' synthesiser I had years ago! Finally, it will plug in to my iPad without the need for external power, meaning it and iPad become a very powerful standalone workstation! (Novation also have free apps specifically designed to work with Launchkey which are just superb to play with.) There are also 25 and 61 key models too depending on how much space you have! This fits my budget and has all the specs I need. Sounds like a winner. Thanks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 Midi over USB can be a bit laggy on PC IME, if your soundcard supports the old fashioned 5 pin din midi connectors it's worth borrowing any cheap keyboard with an old fashioned midi out din port and checking what the lag situation is like going through your soundcard - I notice a big difference with my controller (which has both 5 pin din IO and midi over USB) between using it din->pc soundcard, usb->ipad, usb->pc (best to worst). The difference all lies in the driver implementation IMHO, my PCI soundcard is very low latency for everything(ancient maudio delta 2496), the IOS implentation of midi/audio over usb is pretty damn good, generic PC implementation of midi over USB just sucks for anything that requires precise timing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 1 hour ago, SubsonicSimpleton said: Midi over USB can be a bit laggy on PC IME, if your soundcard supports the old fashioned 5 pin din midi connectors it's worth borrowing any cheap keyboard with an old fashioned midi out din port and checking what the lag situation is like going through your soundcard - I notice a big difference with my controller (which has both 5 pin din IO and midi over USB) between using it din->pc soundcard, usb->ipad, usb->pc (best to worst). The difference all lies in the driver implementation IMHO, my PCI soundcard is very low latency for everything(ancient maudio delta 2496), the IOS implentation of midi/audio over usb is pretty damn good, generic PC implementation of midi over USB just sucks for anything that requires precise timing. Oh that's a shame! I haven't used PC's for a while now so haven't used MIDI over USB on such devices. I agree though, MIDI for Apple devices, OSX or IOS is bang on and so far I've had no problems with that side of things at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 2 hours ago, SubsonicSimpleton said: Midi over USB can be a bit laggy on PC IME, if your soundcard supports the old fashioned 5 pin din midi connectors it's worth borrowing any cheap keyboard with an old fashioned midi out din port and checking what the lag situation is like going through your soundcard - I notice a big difference with my controller (which has both 5 pin din IO and midi over USB) between using it din->pc soundcard, usb->ipad, usb->pc (best to worst). The difference all lies in the driver implementation IMHO, my PCI soundcard is very low latency for everything(ancient maudio delta 2496), the IOS implentation of midi/audio over usb is pretty damn good, generic PC implementation of midi over USB just sucks for anything that requires precise timing. This sounds too technical. Are you saying that midi to PC will have high latency? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartelby Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) I think the issue is midi over USB to PC is an issue. Old school; midi keyboard -> midi interface ->PC isn't Edited May 17, 2018 by bartelby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 Would midi to interface then to PC work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubsonicSimpleton Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 Which audio interface are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) 5 pin din (midi) lead from a controller into a (decent) Interface, then out from the Interface into a PC via USB works absolutely fine with no latency issues. (I use a Steinberg UR22mkII for the above way) I think it's the USB out from a keyboard into the PC via USB that might cause a few problems latency wise reported by some. But, I have a second USB to USB controller, just for single lines and controlling cc#'s etc, and I don't seem to have any latency problems. Maybe any problems are down to interfaces? With such high specs these days, I thought latency wasn't really a major issue anymore? Edited May 17, 2018 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 Focusrite 2i2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 12 minutes ago, SH73 said: Focusrite 2i2 As far as I know, the 2i2 doesn't have midi I/O. I think the 2i4 does though. So you would be relying on USB to USB from the controller. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 17, 2018 Author Share Posted May 17, 2018 I realized. Need a new interface too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) For transparency, I work for Novation & Focusrite and am only chipping in with that hat on as our gear has been mentioned. I’m not personally aware of any lesser latency performance of our midi controllers on PC compared to Mac, that said it’s been a LONG time since i’ve used a PC, long time Mac user. Its worth noting that our Launchkey MK2 doesn’t have a 5pin din connector, largely because we worked on the premise that it simply wasn’t needed. Remember that if you run din through an interface, you’re still connecting to your PC via USB. There may be something in how midi is implemented in the 2i2 driver compared to the Windows driver, however that is a step above my knowledge. I could have our UK based tech support give you a call if you want to ask about it PC midi performance Vs Mac with the Launchkeys, or of course call them at your convenience on: 01494 462246 If there’s anything else I can answer, please let me know. Si // Focusrite & Novation Media Relations Edited May 17, 2018 by Sibob 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 I use a Native Instruments S61 keyboard over USB and haven't once noticed latency to be an issue. Latency is affected by many things (how much you've got going on in your DAW, your CPU power etc.) but on my Focusrite Forte I set it to recording mode with a sample rate of 128 and I can record fine with no noticeable lag with a fair bit going on (i7 4790k at 4.5ghz). I'm also quite active over at VI-control - a forum for composers using virtual instruments (where their PC specs include 64GB RAM and above due to the size of their virtual instrument templates) and there's never any mention of going via midi rather than midi over USB so I'd quite confidently say this is a non issue unless you're using a soundcard not designed for audio production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 I think the main reason folks still use midi 5 pin din (apart from controllers that are not USB), is that you only need to use one USB socket on the puter for the interface. The USB interface then takes care of the Audio and midi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, lowdown said: I think the main reason folks still use midi 5 pin din (apart from controllers that are not USB), is that you only need to use one USB socket on the puter for the interface. The USB interface then takes care of the Audio and midi. I’d tend to agree, although this was more of a consideration when computers had one or two ports, pretty common to have 4 or more nowadays. Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Sibob said: I’d tend to agree, although this was more of a consideration when computers had one or two ports, pretty common to have 4 or more nowadays. Si Yeah, of course.. But these days everything seems to be USB. I think there are more dongles, extra midi controllers & Pads, external hard drives for audio, and the big bespoke sample library hard drives (all fighting for ports). I have eight, seven of them are being used. I suppose the whole thing is never ending... Edited May 17, 2018 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurksalot Posted May 17, 2018 Share Posted May 17, 2018 I use a 5pin din /USB adaptor and latency has never been an issue plugged straight in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH73 Posted May 18, 2018 Author Share Posted May 18, 2018 From above posts I pressume I can connect midi to laptop via interface. or midi direct to laptop using adaptor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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