Finished Pics! A build for our own Len_derby

[Daz39]

Ooh Helix stationery: it’s like school woodwork class again!

[Andyjr1515]

I squared up the neck assembly with a jack plane and then put it through the thicknesser to slim it down to 62mm width (the width of the neck at the point the furthest end meets the body).  I also thinned down the swamp ash back pieces to the 40mm outlined in the drawing above.  Note that the steel fret/blocks template also arrived today!

 

Giving the outline a decent amount of wiggle room, I marked the sides out ready for cutting:

 

...and duly cut them:

The bridge and lightweight tuners, both in black, are on order.  For the bridge, I've ordered a Schaller 2000.  I'm pretty sure it's one of those on @Chris Sharman 's gorgeous 5 string Shuker that I was lucky to temporarily get my mitts on last week.  I was very impressed with the design and quality of the bridge

I can't cut the neck side profile until I've worked out the neck angle, and I always get hold physically of the bridge before I work that out (I draw the neck joint position and angle full size, including the saddle lowest and highest setting points) so won't be doing that yet.  Instead, I'll turn my attention to the fretboard.  I've got just the piece of maple for that

As always, thanks for looking!

 

Edited May 18, 2018 by Andyjr1515

[Andyjr1515]

OK - this post may make the 'routing the block inlay chambers' explanation above a bit more understandable.

First I glued some locating blocks to ensure that a ply worksurface could be securely located on the press-drill bed:

 

Then drilled and inserted the locating pin:

 

When in use, the router bit will be lined up to this pin:

 

So now imagine that the fretboard blank has been double-side taped on top of the metal template here:

So the drill spindle is lowered into the fretboard, and then the template/fretboard assembly is moved around the pin, cutting the block-shaped outline.

With the outline routed, I will use the Dremel precision router base and a larger router bit to clear the inside of the rectangle.

So just got to find a way of fixing the drill in the lowered position (it is spring loaded and no lock mechanism).  I might just rig up a rubber band or similar to keep the drilling handle fully down.

 

 

BUT first, I will have to cut the frets.  Although this is a G&W template, intended to be used in the G&W mitre box, you can't do both operations with the template stuck to the fretboard in the same position!  The locating pin in the mitre-box for slotting the frets is offset - and the rectangles on this template are not offset.  

So, the sequence to avoid scrapping a few fretboards is, I reckon:

• Stick the fretboard to the template
• Slot the fretboard
• Unstick the fretboard from the template
• Restick the fretboard to the template taking huge care that the fret index points on the template line up exactly with the fretslots and that the fretboard is absolutely square with the template.  Bearing in mind that the template is underneath and the cut fretslots are on top, this is going to take significant care - especially as it is lining up and then fixing onto two-sided tape.
• Rout the rectangles

On the other hand, if the blocks had been offset to the fret cutting index notches to match the offset on their mitre box, it would have been a doddle.  I like G&W product range and quality, but they really haven't thought this through...

 

 

[Andyjr1515]

Off to watch some music this eve so just a brief update.  Tackled the blocks routing.

 

That required the board to be radiused and then slotted:

Then, removal from the template and re-positioning back onto the template to rout the outline.  The raggedy edges from the slow speed and non-ideal bit are actually clean and will tidy up just with some sandpaper:

 

And then started hogging out a touch with a larger bit.  Final leveling and height adjustment will be done with a chisel.

I'll pop a bit more detail in tomorrow.  It's worked out better than I expected for the first go, though...

[stearstree1304]

this all looks terribly fiddly...

[Andyjr1515]

Well - I was fully expecting that the first shot at the block routing would end in a scrapper.  But - unless I mess up getting the ebony rectangles in - I think I was wrong!  To my utter surprise, the block routs appear to be clean-sided and in the right place:

All of the inner rectangles have been routed flat but will be chiselled individually when I fit the ebony rectangles - they must be deep enough to sink in the sides without being too deep to below the fretboard height in the middle.

Back to the reason for the repositioning on the template....

Basically, the fretboard blank is double-side-taped to the metal template for both fret slotting and for routing the rectangles.  In both cases, the template is positioned by use of a small index pin.

However, in the fret slotting jig, the index pin is offset to the position of the cut:

 

However, the template rectangles for the blocks are in line with the index pin notches in the template - not offset:

And so, after fret slotting, the fretboard blank needs to be repositioned so that the rectangles are central and also that the index pin notches are now in line with the fretslots and not offset:

I'll bet that's as clear as mud, isn't it

 

Edited May 25, 2018 by Andyjr1515

[Andyjr1515]

5 minutes ago, stearstree1304 said:

this all looks terribly fiddly...

Yes it is  

 

But done manually like this, just takes care and time.  Normally this would be done on a CNC

[stearstree1304]

To quote the late Fred Dibnah, technology doesn't make things better, it just makes them cheaper and quicker.

You can keep your CNC machine...

[Andyjr1515]

Back from Scotland and most of the pressing domestic chores are on track, so the priority for the next few weeks is this!

Made a fair bit of progress this afternoon and there should be leap in progress tomorrow.  Today was all about measuring, checking, re-measuring, checking and checking again before doing one of the crucial cuts - the slot in the neck for the top to slot into.

This includes the crucial neck angle - hence the multiple checks.

Also - because theoretically the bridge could go anywhere within a range, it was time to predict balance, playability, arm stretch.  This is particularly important as Neil has a pesky shoulder issue at the moment - this design aims for sound, playability, lightness, balance and modest stretch.  And as some of these aspects tend to be mutually exclusive....

These are some of the key positions - probably some final tweaking to do on body shape once all the functional positioning is sorted but the latter needs sorting first!

Body-wise, this is going to be a very light bass.  But it is nevertheless 34" maple-necked and so steps to avoid neck dive is something to always be aware of:

• Wherever this is a possibility, then it always helps for the top strap button (red line) to be in the 'goldilocks zone'.  My usual rule of thumb is that the goldilocks zone is somewhere between the 12th and 14th frets (yellow lines).
• Bringing the bridge well back does two things: it reduces the playing stretch a touch; it brings the strap-button into the goldilocks zone.  With the position of the strap on the button itself, I judge this will be in line with the 13.5 fret position - so even if the body ends up much lighter than the norm, it should still balance fine on the strap
• The next position consideration is the lower cutaway for access to the top frets.  For no better reason than it is an option, Neil and I decided to go for the full 24 frets.  I've deepened the cutaway a tad to provide complete access to the 22nd fret.  For the 23rd and 24th, I'll wait until the top and back is on and shaped to see if this gives good enough access to the 23d and 24th and then Neil and I can discuss whether to deepen the cutaway anymore
• Depending on the cutaway depth, I'll give Neil the option of reshaping the lower horn.  It's just aesthetics so no problem to do that or leave it and it can be left until quite late in the build.

 

So before cutting the slot in the neck, I needed to calculate the neck angle.  I'll post that process shortly

[Andyjr1515]

I usually build through necks and always physically draw the key neck angle points full size, and always using the actual bridge intended to be fitted.  I measure the bridge saddle at lowest and highest, mark the neck angle fulcrum, then the fretboard and fret height, the planned action height and set the neck angle to allow some wiggle room either way.  As it happens, with the Schaller bridge and my thickness of fretboard and fret-height, the neck will be zero angle:

 

 

Then I can cut the slot:

 

 

Once the body demarcation veneer has been added, this will be spot on.  Because the angle is zero, then I don't have to allow for the apex that normally the fretboard end has to be sunk into.

You can see here above the pencil line on the maple of how thin the neck will be cut to.

 

And finally the components in their respective positions:

 

 

Tomorrow should see the backs prepared, the neck blank cut to basic plan and side-view profile and then the backs glued to the neck....

 

Edited June 6, 2018 by Andyjr1515

[TheGreek]

Can't wait for tomorrow's instalment...

Keep up the good work.

 

[Andyjr1515]

Neck blank cut:

 

The demarcation veneer I will be using on this one for the top/back, the back/neck and neck/fretboard is Redwood (and it is indeed red wood!).  It will darken slightly with the finish but should tone nicely with the brownish hue of the poplar figuring. 

 

Here are the veneers being glued to the back joins:

It's a while before the top gets glued on - in the meantime I'll try a couple of samples with just this veneer as the main back/top, or triple it up with two redwood veneers and a contrasting one (probably ebony to link with the hardware) in the middle.  Might look a little fussy when the top carve cuts through, but you never know unless you try it!

 

[Andyjr1515]

With the demarcation veneer installed, next job was to flip the neck upside down and glue the oversize back swamp-ash wings flush with the neck slot:

 

 

I do all of this a tad unconventionally.   Once the chambers and cable runs have been routed out, the top will be glued on the flat area like this and then used as the routing template for the back.  Note the pencil line showing possible shortening of the lower horn to get the curves looking more in proportion.  Clearly, I will decide on this before gluing on the top :

 

When I flip it over, you can see how far I will be scooping the back wings - ie down to the neck in the middle, eventually producing a concave curve:

[Jimothey]

Looking good! I really do like that top! 

I think that the bottom horn would look better shortened a bit 😀

[Andyjr1515]

8 hours ago, Jimothey said:

Looking good! I really do like that top! 

I think that the bottom horn would look better shortened a bit 😀

Yes, me too.  Deepening the cutout for the fret access changed the proportions and just needs balancing up a bit.  There are some flat spots in some of the curves too which will be smoothed out before it gets glued on.

Edited June 8, 2018 by Andyjr1515

[FuNkShUi]

Crazy amount of detail in your build Andy. Awesome to see it.
Nice job, again!

[Andyjr1515]

1 minute ago, FuNkShUi said:

Crazy amount of detail in your build Andy. Awesome to see it.
Nice job, again!

Thanks!  Trust all is well with you and yours

[SpondonBassed]

11 hours ago, Jimothey said:

Looking good! I really do like that top! 

I think that the bottom horn would look better shortened a bit 😀

I agree.

Looking at it another way...  a shortened bottom would look hornier.

(It must be that time of year where I usually get referred off to have my bumps felt)

[Len_derby]

Well, I've just spent the last five days like this; off grid, under canvas, with 60 10&11 year olds and performing outward bound-type activities near Doncaster.

This was a very nice set of postings to come home to.

And I like the low horn as it is.

Edited June 8, 2018 by Len_derby

[ezbass]

49 minutes ago, Len_derby said:

Well, I've just spent the last five days like this; off grid, under canvas, with 60 10&11 year olds and performing outward bound-type activities near Doncaster.

This was a very nice set of postings to come home to.

And I like the low horn as it is.

Ah, the joys of the year 6 residential, I feel your pain. I’m off on my annual ‘cat herding’ a fortnight Monday. 😬

[Jimothey]

2 hours ago, Len_derby said:

Well, I've just spent the last five days like this; off grid, under canvas, with 60 10&11 year olds and performing outward bound-type activities near Doncaster.

Its bad enough having to spend it with 60 kids but having to go to Doncaster as well I feel your pain!! 😁

[SpondonBassed]

Non-parent here.

*gloat*

[Andyjr1515]

On the sample I've actually got this back to front, but I think this will be just right for the demarcation line:

 

I tried doubling up and also doing a redwood/ebony/redwood and redwood/maple/redwood sandwich but the former one didn't add anything and the latter two looked a bit tacky - a bit  'trying too hard'.

So next jobs are adding the redwood veneer onto the (bottom of the) top and routing the chambers and cable routings on the back.  With luck, this will be all done and the top glued on before the end of the weekend.    

[ezbass]

7 hours ago, SpondonBassed said:

Non-parent here.

*gloat*

My ‘baby’ is 36, I go as an ex-member of staff/governor volunteer, these days. Glutton for punishment, that’s me.

 

Sorry for the derail, Andy 😊

Edited June 9, 2018 by ezbass

[Andyjr1515]

Having worked out the carve shape - and therefore the thickness of the body at various points in the cross-section - I was able to rout the main chambers and cable routes. 

Control chamber-wise, we are going for a Master Vol/Master Tone/Blend option, with the pots following the curve of the lower bout. 

Theoretically, I could rout deeper at the areas further from the neck but the swampash is so light it really won't make a difference.

The rout in the top is more for aesthetics than weight.  Bear in mind that the top will be curved and so this will slim quite a bit, it will eventually give the illusion of being a semi, when it's actually basically a solid:

Before popping the top on, I will line the f-hole chamber with some redwood veneer to further give the illusion of depth.