Who are we kidding - does great bass tone REALLY matter?

[Al Krow]

Great bass tone - if it brings a smile to my face when I'm playing, that's a good enough reason, right? The same reason that I have too many basses, 3 rigs and a host of pedals and spend endless hours on this forum. Like you guys, I'm passionate about bass.

BUT do our bands and audiences really care? What do they want from a bass player. For them, I think that me, my Ibanez SR and my Markbass combo are just fine. It's plenty 'good enough'. No pedals, no compression, just me, the bass, amp and cab. No complaints and smiles all around at the end of each gig.

It seems to me that it's far more important to them that I am a really good bass player which I equate with being technically proficient, playing with a groove and sitting tight with the drums and that I don't f*uck up! Bass tone is not even secondary concern for them - it's so far down the list in comparison to being a good bass player that's it's not even visible.

One of my BC buddies strongly disagrees: "personally I think audiences do care even if they don’t know it, and if your band mates don’t care then they are dullards and self-centred. Tone is a collective so everyone’s should blend with each other, no one’s is more important. To me groove and tone are intimately linked, actually how you groove and play sets the tone, pick style, finger style, slap all give tonal differences, AND they have to be in time. Not saying there is owt wrong with Ibby and MB, but I cannot see how another musician or indeed punter does not care about tone, that baffles me I am afraid."

What do you guys think? Is he right? What are audiences really after from us as bass players?

 

[Beedster]

I think there's an emotional/subconscious level at which all tone matters hugely, perhaps not fine-grain tone but certainly when the differences are audible (i.e., good rig compared to bad rig). Whilst it matters to us bassers in quite an explicit way, I think it's more implicit with audiences. I hear a great tone and to me I know/think it was a great tone; audiences would perhaps experience greater positive emotion throiugh listening to the music but not identify the tone per se? 

So yes, tone matters to us all. This opinion might however be my executive brain trying to explain the fact that my emotional brain keeps buying rigs

[Frank Blank]

7 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

What do you guys think? Is he right? What are audiences really after from us as bass players?

Something to make them groove. Speaking as a text book self-centred dullard I think the subtleties of tone are lost on the majority or punters.

[ambient]

Often what we consider is a great’ tone soloed isn’t so good in a live band context. I also think the average person in the audience isn’t particularly bothered. I also, probably somewhat controversially think that we should learn to use what we've got, I think we tend to sound like 'us', whether it's 'us' playing the bass we've had for the last year or so, or 'us' playing the bass that we're really gassing for.

Edited February 8, 2018 by ambient

[Frank Blank]

We had quite a lengthy discussion about similar matters here...

 

[SteveK]

Too many of us are obsessive about gear and looking for that elusive tone/sound. If the money spent on gear were directed towards decent lessons then that tone/sound may be more easily achieved.

[Frank Blank]

6 minutes ago, Beedster said:

I think there's an emotional/subconscious level at which all tone matters hugely, perhaps not fine-grain tone but certainly when the differences are audible (i.e., good rig compared to bad rig). Whilst it matters to us bassers in quite an explicit way, I think it's more implicit with audiences. I hear a great tone and to me I know/think it was a great tone; audiences would perhaps experience greater positive emotion throiugh listening to the music but not identify the tone per se? 

So yes, tone matters to us all. This opinion might however be my executive brain trying to explain the fact that my emotional brain keeps buying rigs

Actually this is making me perhaps modify my thoughts, I am not a specialist in any field really but I am savvy enough sometimes to just know when something (perhaps something I am not knowledgeable enough to comprehend or single out) is wrong...

...audiences would perhaps experience greater positive emotion through listening to the music but not identify the tone per se?

...Hmmmmm, yes, thought provoking.

[skidder652003]

Hmm to your average pub punter, as long as its not too loud, or quiet, not too muddy or too distorted, they couldn't care less if Im lugging my heavy valve rig or DI'ing straight into the desk, I only choose for my own pleasure.

[Horrorhiker]

I would argue that tone is hugely important when recording, and then when playing live, replicating that tone matters, if you play in a band where people know your stuff. It's one of those things that a real bad tone sticks out like a sore thumb, and an excellent or average tone are accepted with disinterest, equally by the majority of audience members. There's something to be said about, if you're being ignored, you're doing a good job to some extent maybe. 

John Deacon springs to mind. (Unless you play bass) he's relatively anonymous both visually and in terms of sound when playing live, until he gets a Killer Queen fill in, or Under Pressure starts, and at that point, everyone in the place appreciates bass tone, whether they know it or not. 

Also, if you're playing Level 42 covers, bass tone is more important than when playing Summer Of '69 (probably). 

[Frank Blank]

7 minutes ago, Horrorhiker said:

Also, if you're playing Level 42 covers, bass tone is more important than when playing Summer Of '69 (probably). 

If you are playing Level 42 covers it’s probably time to shut a piano lid on your fingers.

[Horrorhiker]

Just now, Frank Blank said:

If you are playing Level 42 covers it’s probably time to shut a piano lid on your fingers.

Ha ha ha. Sound like you need a few lessons in love.

[Frank Blank]

2 minutes ago, Horrorhiker said:

Ha ha ha. Sound like you need a few lessons in love.

I’m already in hot water. It’s funny how John Deacon never actually springs to mind but is such a vital part of that band, what a dude.

[TheGreek]

IMO it's a bit like customer service - if you get good customer service, nobody says anything, when it's rubbish everybody's up in arms.

If nobody says anything about your tone, you're probably doing something right.

Personally if I don't like the bass tone, I don't like the song.

[Frank Blank]

1 minute ago, TheGreek said:

IMO it's a bit like customer service - if you get good customer service, nobody says anything, when it's rubbish everybody's up in arms.

If nobody says anything about your tone, you're probably doing something right.

Personally if I don't like the bass tone, I don't like the song.

This is a good analogy. I’m trying to think of a song I like which involves a bass tone I don’t like and I can’t, apart from everything by Level 42 obviously.

[Horrorhiker]

Just now, Frank Blank said:

I’m already in hot water. It’s funny how John Deacon never actually springs to mind but is such a vital part of that band, what a dude.

Yeah, It's not like he's underrated or anything but he does fly under the radar until it's his time to shine. Queen were the first actual 'guitar band' I was into as a kid and I spent all my time watching a couple of Queen live VHS's. For some unknown reason, Deacon stood out to me and is 100% the reason I play bass and not guitar all these years later.

[Frank Blank]

1 minute ago, Horrorhiker said:

Yeah, It's not like he's underrated or anything but he does fly under the radar until it's his time to shine. Queen were the first actual 'guitar band' I was into as a kid and I spent all my time watching a couple of Queen live VHS's. For some unknown reason, Deacon stood out to me and is 100% the reason I play bass and not guitar all these years later.

Excellent, Queen were quite formative for me too, even though I shouldn’t admit to that as a punk. Queen were a band my brother played me a lot of before the punk thing happened. Actually, thinking about it, They were one of the bands I just carried on listening to through the upheavals of punk.

[BigRedX]

A great bass tone is one that sounds great within the context of the song/track/band.

It doesn't matter what it sounds like on its own.

[mikel]

A great, subjective, bass tone is a lot like a great drum sound, it has to sound good in the mix of instruments. I also play drums and I let the drums ring out, no damping. It means they then sound good, and also cut through, in the mix. Played in isolation they can sound too much but in a band situation they are perfect. I suggest a bass tone is the same.

[EssentialTension]

Did a gig last weekend and used someone else's rig. There were two cabs, possibly a 12" and a 15". I don't remember what make of amp, I didn't take much notice. I did move the lowest EQ slider down a little when FOH guy said it was quite bassy. But I stuck to neck pickup and full tone and volume on my bass. I've found over the years it doesn't pay to sweat too much over these things. I was later told 'It sounded good out front'.

[T-Bay]

19 minutes ago, TheGreek said:

IMO it's a bit like customer service - if you get good customer service, nobody says anything, when it's rubbish everybody's up in arms.

If nobody says anything about your tone, you're probably doing something right.

Personally if I don't like the bass tone, I don't like the song.

This^^^^^ Muse is the evidence of this for me, the tone that some people love really really grates on me and it’s an instant reach for the off button.

[lojo]

If I've got a nice tone in my rig I can enjoy my playing , sometimes if I wonder away and near another monitor or toward the front speakers and I hear a less lovely tone it puts me off , so for that reason I think "I'm worth it"

[gjones]

I'm not after an unachievable tone,  It just has to be clear, deep and punchy out front. A lot of the time I don't hear the same bass tone as the audience hears, because I'm too close to my cab. I set my EQ and hope they're hearing what I want them to hear. Occasionally I get compliments on my bass tone from punters but usually it's only other musicians, who happen to be in the audience. that notice.

[Horrorhiker]

27 minutes ago, Frank Blank said:

Excellent, Queen were quite formative for me too, even though I shouldn’t admit to that as a punk. Queen were a band my brother played me a lot of before the punk thing happened. Actually, thinking about it, They were one of the bands I just carried on listening to through the upheavals of punk.

I'm in an old school hardcore band funny enough. I went metal after Queen but have always loved them. I also like Floyd, and Roxy Music a lot. Brainy rich person music ftw. 

[Lozz196]

I thing genre and the position the bass  has in the band have a fair bit to do with it as well, I`ve probably had more people come up to me complimenting my tone since I`ve been using a twangy/driven sound in my punk band than at any time in my previous bands. And that`s partly due to the genre, and the bass taking on an almost rhythm guitar quality as we`re a 3 piece. Whilst my tone is right for this band, I preferred my Precision into my Ampeg PF500, all eq set flat, touch of compression tone as the best tone I`ve ever had. But at that point the bass was in a more supporting role, not so prominent.

[CameronJ]

I think @Lozz196 has hit the nail on the head. Most people care that the bass is actually audible and that our bass tone is in the right ballpark for the genre. Ballparks are broad though, and 9 times out of 10 nobody but ourselves could care less about the little tonal nuances that we spend hours obsessing over.