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Sampling.. but is it proper music making etc?


Barking Spiders

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2 hours ago, Maude said:

The Beastie Boys first album,  License to Ill,  samples Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, AC/DC, The Clash, Steve Miller Band, Kool and the Gang, Barry White, Creedence Clearwater Revival and Joan Jetty and the Blackhearts among others and completely changes the style the sampled music. Arguably changed the face of hip hop and is a bona-fide classic in its own right. I'd hope that people who don't like hip hop would agree that The Beastie Boys were not talentless oiks stealing other peoples music. 

Also one of the best live bands I've ever had the privilege to see and ,when they chose to be, an excellent funk/jazz 3 piece  (guitar,bass,drums) in their own right.

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14 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Using that same 'logic', all Australians are Fosters-swilling, cork-hat-wearing, culture-less surfing loafers. Slightly reductionist, no..? :|

I said artists that ONLY use samples. If they actually do something creative with them then that is different.

Mate, Aussies don't drink Fosters, we export it to you  to drink :)

 

England has never recovered from the blunder of sending the convicts to the land of sun , surf, and good times. leaving the do gooders in dank depressing wet England lol

 

Edited by bazzbass
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Some highly innovative artists that use samplers extensively and are well worth checking out are The Young Gods and Amon Tobin. When the YG's first albums came out in the late 80s they made guitar based rock sound prehistoric they way they could fuse thrash metal, French folk, dance, modern classical etc into one sound. And they came before Nine Inch Nails. Best albums to check out, L' Eau Rouge, TV Sky

Amon Tobin is a Brazilian fella who's released around half a dozen albums mashing up horror film scores, jazz, drum n bass, breakbeat, classical all sorts. Best albums to check out are his first four on Ninja Tune

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49 minutes ago, Barking Spiders said:

Some highly innovative artists that use samplers extensively and are well worth checking out are The Young Gods and Amon Tobin. When the YG's first albums came out in the late 80s they made guitar based rock sound prehistoric they way they could fuse thrash metal, French folk, dance, modern classical etc into one sound. And they came before Nine Inch Nails. Best albums to check out, L' Eau Rouge, TV Sky

 

I'm just listening to Young God's Live Sky Tour album.

I've been a big fan of theirs since the Kurt Weill album

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5 hours ago, bazzbass said:

I said artists that ONLY use samples. If they actually do something creative with them then that is different.

 

If you ONLY use samples from preexisting pieces of music, and assemble them in a different way to create something new, that is creative by definition. 

Sometimes it's done lazily, sure, but no more so than lazy songwriters knocking out obvious progressions/cheesy lyrics. 

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3 minutes ago, mike257 said:

If you ONLY use samples from preexisting pieces of music, and assemble them in a different way to create something new, that is creative by definition. 

Sometimes it's done lazily, sure, but no more so than lazy songwriters knocking out obvious progressions/cheesy lyrics. 

Not bazzbass' definition, obviously...

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On 10/01/2018 at 14:18, bazzbass said:

artists that only use samples have no artistic talent, all they are are arrangers of pre-existing music, created by others.

 

23 hours ago, PaulWarning said:

isn't sampling a way of copying someone else's idea when you aren't good enough to play it yourself?

So you think something like the video below involves no artistic talent to create? Really?

You should maybe invite this guy along to some of your pub gigs, let him see what true artistic creativity looks like... ;) 

PS: all made with sampled YouTube clips.

 

Edited by Skol303
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Sampling can be incredibly creative and requires lots of musicality and talent to get it right. It also exposes some great musicians who could, otherwise get overlooked. Two great examples, Camille Yarborough, Take Yo Praise (Fatboy Slim, Praise You) and Dave Peacock, yes Chas & Dave, on Eminem's Track, title of which currently escapes me.

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5 hours ago, Skol303 said:

 

So you think something like the video below involves no artistic talent to create? Really?

You should maybe invite this guy along to some of your pub gigs, let him see what true artistic creativity looks like... ;) 

PS: all made with sampled YouTube clips.

 

very clever I'm sure, not really my cup of tea, I'm more of a Rock and Roll sort of guy, I'm probably showing my complete ignorance here but you say invite him to one of our pub gigs, how would it be done it live?

Edited by PaulWarning
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1 hour ago, PaulWarning said:

very clever I'm sure, not really my cup of tea, I'm more of a Rock and Roll sort of guy, I'm probably showing my complete ignorance here but you say invite him to one of our pub gigs, how would it be done it live?

I was joking :)

Point being (although badly made) that artistry in music can take lots of different forms; and I'd argue that creating something like the above video entirely from clips of other people's performances is no less valid than playing live in a pub.

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You can buy a million different instruments that trigger samples for live use.

If you use a drum machine, in most cases you're pretty much just triggering samples. 

The Mellotron synth, which appeared on a thousand famous rock albums in the 70s was just a keyboard that triggered samples. 

If you use reverb in the studio, in most cases these days the reverb will be created using samples. 

Sampling's come a long way since Jive Bunny.

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you see, me being old school, if you can't do it live I'm not really interested, to me it's a bit like going down the local pub and finding a singer singing along to a backing tape, it's just cheating as far as I'm concerned, loopers are the same, but I do realise I'm just an old fart from a bygone age, oh yeah, don't like rap either, or all the many genres of it, you see I quite like a melody line to hook up too, told you I was old school 

Edited by PaulWarning
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8 hours ago, PaulWarning said:

you see, me being old school, if you can't do it live I'm not really interested, to me it's a bit like going down the local pub and finding a singer singing along to a backing tape, it's just cheating as far as I'm concerned, loopers are the same, but I do realise I'm just an old fart from a bygone age, oh yeah, don't like rap either, or all the many genres of it, you see I quite like a melody line to hook up too, told you I was old school 

Most sampling you can do live, most electronic groups do, art of noise did, peter gabriel did, pink floyd did dark side live.

Rap also is very commonly done live and has a strong melody line in most cases.

So what you are specifically saying is you don't like that sort of music. Thats fine, but not really relevant to sampling as an art form is it?

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I haven't seen jazz mentioned yet. The OP used the example of Puff/P Diddy/Daddy/Doddy's use of Every Breath You Take. Half the jazz tunes out there use exactly the same chord progressions as a lot of other jazz tunes. They just right their own tune over the top. Just the same sort of use in a different time.

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Not a fan of Hip Hop or Rap or most forms of modern music but I have no problem with those folks using samples. It's an economical way to record,apart from the royalties part, and it engages the audience straight away. Lots of times they already know the tunes the sample came from as their folks played the original.

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