jrixn1 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Following on from the "Interesting FRFR story" thread - https://www.basschat.co.uk/topic/315455-interesting-frfr-story/ - I bought an RCF "HD 10-A MK4" powered speaker, which was £350 from gear4music. For my needs at least (i.e. completely subjective), having gigged it now, my current feeling is that this could take the place of my Genz Benz Shuttle 9.2 + Barefaced One10. There was no sacrifice in volume or tone. The lowest notes were deep and full. The volume was on 50%, although it's hard to know how much more it had in reserve (maybe loads, or maybe I was right at its usable limit - no idea). I'm normally running my Shuttle at 50% - 75%. It was easier to set up and tear down - um, not that a head and one cab is that hard - but it was even easier. When you're done, you just pick it up and go... It weighs 12kg. The One10 & Shuttle & angled stand is 11.6kg. I've only done one gig but it was pretty representative of the gigs I tend to do. I can report back if there are any developments at subsequent gigs. http://www.rcf.it/en_US/professional-speaker-systems/d-line/hd-10-a-mk4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pea Turgh Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 800 Watts?! Spl of 128dB?! £350!?! Cant help thinking this might have been the better option than the Ampeg PF350 and two One10’s I recently bought (for significantly more dosh!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Makes total sense to me, I doubt I'll ever buy another bass amp/cab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 30 minutes ago, Pea Turgh said: 800 Watts?! Spl of 128dB?! £350!?! Cant help thinking this might have been the better option than the Ampeg PF350 and two One10’s I recently bought (for significantly more dosh!) Probably not. That is peak power. The cab is only rated at 400 watts. . . . and definitely a lot, lot less than that for bass frequencies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Perfect for on-stage monitoring if playing with FOH I`d think. You can even max out and get the 12" version. If like me you get all your eq from a pre-amp pedal I daresay this could be an ideal backup in the van type of bit of gear as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pea Turgh Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 11 minutes ago, chris_b said: Probably not. That is peak power. The cab is only rated at 400 watts. . . . and definitely a lot, lot less than that for bass frequencies. I feel better now. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largo Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 Isn't this the law of diminishing returns as well? A 2nd BF One10 will add another 7kg of weight but a second RCF will add another 12kg. Does look like a great wee setup mind you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrixn1 Posted January 7, 2018 Author Share Posted January 7, 2018 @Pea Turgh The RCF marketing says "800 watt 2-way peak power" but it's not comparing like-for-like. One of these RCFs could not replace two One10s. @Lozz196 Yes, I'm mainly playing functions/weddings with full PA, so I only need to worry about my personal on-stage sound. Tone-shaping and HPF is from a pedal. @largo This is true. For me, one RCF or one One10 will be fine for 90% of my gigs. But for the other 10% - I'm not sure now whether to get a second RCF or stick with two One10s (I have two already). Ultimately, I think I'd rather just have one system (either RCF or Barefaced - but not both), as I know from previous experience that having two overlapping systems I end up wasting lots of time debating with myself which one is "better" - a completely pointless inner monologue, but I can't turn it off. But if I only have one system, there is no decision to be made, and I can move on with my life! Dunno if that makes any sense to anyone! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pea Turgh Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 56 minutes ago, jrixn1 said: @Pea Turgh The RCF marketing says "800 watt 2-way peak power" but it's not comparing like-for-like. One of these RCFs could not replace two One10s. @Lozz196 Yes, I'm mainly playing functions/weddings with full PA, so I only need to worry about my personal on-stage sound. Tone-shaping and HPF is from a pedal. @largo This is true. For me, one RCF or one One10 will be fine for 90% of my gigs. But for the other 10% - I'm not sure now whether to get a second RCF or stick with two One10s (I have two already). Ultimately, I think I'd rather just have one system (either RCF or Barefaced - but not both), as I know from previous experience that having two overlapping systems I end up wasting lots of time debating with myself which one is "better" - a completely pointless inner monologue, but I can't turn it off. But if I only have one system, there is no decision to be made, and I can move on with my life! Dunno if that makes any sense to anyone! That’s the side effect of these forums (or fora?) is the constant re-evaluation of your tools. Until I signed up to Basschat, I was quite happy with my bass and amp! Prior to that I spent far too much time thinking/planning/buying/selling recording gear! I have settled down a bit now, and i’m also very happy with my head & cabs, I should just exercise a little self discipline and just play the bloody thing more! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec Posted January 7, 2018 Share Posted January 7, 2018 I have 4 RCF ART 710s (fairly similar to the HD10) that I use for foldback or even FOH for smaller gigs, but wouldn't really go for one as a gig rig unless it was a fairly low level show. While they deliver a phenomenal HI FI performance, and are ideal for PA, they'd never have enough grunt for bottom end for me - plus the voicing of a typical bass amp is completely different from a flat PA. Don't listen to your doubts, just be happy with your existing bass gear (like that will ever happen! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 A lot of players would find a single 10 inadequate for their needs, me included, but if it works for the OP, then the RCF is the obvious winner here from just about every angle. As Lozz says, if you have doubts about whether the HD 10 will be loud enough, consider the 12" version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 27 minutes ago, stevie said: A lot of players would find a single 10 inadequate for their needs, me included, but if it works for the OP, then the RCF is the obvious winner here from just about every angle. As Lozz says, if you have doubts about whether the HD 10 will be loud enough, consider the 12" version. A single 10 wouldn't be my choice either... but I guess if the OP is used to a single 10 from the BF, then maybe the single 10 RCF not a bad alternative. @largo - the redundancy of a second powered cab kinda appeals to me for 5kg. @jrixn1 - are you going straight from the zoom into the RCF? Or still using the Genz as a pre? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 PS @jrixn1 - you b*stard! You're killing rock n roll (headnod to Interesting FRFR story) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrixn1 Posted January 8, 2018 Author Share Posted January 8, 2018 Just to clarify - my starting point is that I was already happily using just a single One10. This 10" + 1" RCF definitely won't replace a larger rig! The redundancy of having two RCFs is a good consideration i.e. built-in contingency in case one of them fails. I am going straight from the Zoom MS-60B into the RCF, which has a selector for line level or mic level. The Zoom is outputting at instrument level (i.e. the same volume whether I use the Zoom or bypass it) - so I have the RCF set on mic level. Should I increase the output level of my Zoom patches and use the RCF's line level setting? My feeling is that it doesn't matter either way - but let me know if that's wrong. The larger 12" RCF is an option - and I also considered a QSC 10.2 (just as @Bridgehouse did in the "Interesting FRFR story" thread) - but both those alternatives are heavier and more expensive. I'm sure the QSC are better and louder than the RCF, so I think it's the age-old problem of balancing weight, cost, and performance. And yes, apologies for killing rock'n'roll - guilty as charged Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lownote Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 (edited) Sorry to piggyback your thread but you’ve given me an idea. I’ve been looking to downsize from a bf 210 to maybe a tc 2x8. But now you’re making me wonder if my 280w alto tx10 monitor would work for pc and small gigs. Would it work as a small combo or will putting a bass though it blow the driver? Edited January 8, 2018 by lownote12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabag Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Those RCF 12's are not cheap. £1200 i've seen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 1 hour ago, fleabag said: Those RCF 12's are not cheap. £1200 i've seen Which ones? ART 732 - circa 730 quid each HD32a - circa 820 quid each 4PRO 2031-A - circa 770 each TT22As run about 2000 each Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabag Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 https://www.bax-shop.co.uk/floor-monitors/rcf-nx-12-sma-stage-monitor?gclid=Cj0KCQiAyszSBRDJARIsAHAqQ4pxzAbXqc2BjftjCAFyTqfQhzsXS9Em8VMX7zZTrKZNlUMr3TH6lrcaAo-5EALw_wcB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted January 8, 2018 Share Posted January 8, 2018 Ah - the NX floor monitors - yeah, they are. Was thinking FoH speakers and couldn't think of one that fit the bill! Yeah, I'd like one of those! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronJ Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Why are the NX speakers so much more expensive than the other RCF 12s?! Maybe I’m missing something but I don’t see any reason for it specs-wise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabag Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 2 hours ago, EBS_freak said: Ah - the NX floor monitors - yeah, they are. Was thinking FoH speakers and couldn't think of one that fit the bill! Yeah, I'd like one of those! Likewise, monsuier freak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EBS_freak Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 4 hours ago, CameronJ said: Why are the NX speakers so much more expensive than the other RCF 12s?! Maybe I’m missing something but I don’t see any reason for it specs-wise? Probably different speakers again - not all speakers are born equal. Big step up is it is RCF's entry into the wooden box offerings... whether it justifies that sort of price hike... well, thats a different argument! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronJ Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 8 hours ago, EBS_freak said: Probably different speakers again - not all speakers are born equal. Big step up is it is RCF's entry into the wooden box offerings... whether it justifies that sort of price hike... well, thats a different argument! Ah, ok. That partly explains things but I won’t delve into the argument further 😅 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 Gear4music have the HD-12 in for £547, although it perhaps doesn't qualify as ultra-light at 17kg. One of the reasons for the higher price of the NX models is neodymium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGBrown Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 NX have coaxial speakers: The horn is mounted in the middle of the 12" driver so I guess that would add to the cost. http://www.rcf.it/en_US/products/pro-speaker-systems/nx-series/nx-12-sma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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