Al Krow Posted December 11, 2017 Author Share Posted December 11, 2017 26 minutes ago, Jack said: To specifically answer the OP's question: compressors as a separate device became more popular with the advent of good solid state amps that slowly started to replace tube amps and their natural compression. Many of the early SS greats like Trace and SWR included compressors in the amp for this very reason and for everyone else there were pedals. 20 minutes ago, discreet said: Yes. The compression you get from all-valve amps could be part of the reason they're seen as sounding 'better' than SS amps. As you say, valve compression is natural whereas if you're using a pedal, lots of extra 'user available' parameters are introduced - which perhaps is why people get a bit hung up about them. Maybe a bit of sidetrack - but that is a really interesting insight, thanks. But how far does it go? Is the natural valve compression what gives them their "magic" vs SS, I was kinda assuming that there would be a fair bit more to it than that? If it is a 'key' part of that additional valve magic, I would be an immediate convert to compression for sure. (And that is before all the other benefits of a more centred and even sound, rounding out filter spikes and cab protection etc). Coming back to my original Q in terms of 'when?' are we therefore tying in the more widespread use of compressor pedals to the demise of valve amps and the rise of SS A/B and subsequently D class amps? If so mid 1990s? Just to be controversial (unlike me right? ) It's interesting that there have been no (or at least very few) new world class rock bands emerging since the mid / late 1990s. Just a coincidence of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osiris Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 According to this article, compression has been around since the 1930's. Although admittedly it's a bit light on specific details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Dare Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 1 hour ago, BigRedX said: Most bassists who claim not to need compression probably have something in their signal chain that is actually doing the job of a compressor. Where it is valves in the amp or something in the sound coming out of the PA. The only way you guarantee not to have any compression in your bass sound is if you: 1. Don't go through the PA 2. Use a transistor amp (not class D) with the input gain well below the level at which the clip light comes on and still plenty of clean extra volume available on the master volume control. 3. Don't have any overdrive/distortion/fuzz effects. 4. Don't use any digital effects. 5. Don't use a wireless system. You forgot a very important point. You must use a cab that is capable of reproducing the full frequency range fed to it and at full volume. Such a beast does not exist in any transportable format. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bay Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I use a compressor as an always on pedal dialled down pretty low. I don’t use if for the compression as such (hence the setting) but do find it adds a nice extra fullness to the tone. I was sceptical at first but tried it after reading threads on here and pleased I did. I don’t like the way they clip at higher settings, it removed the possibilities that playing finger style allows me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Bas, To name a few from mid nineties onwards Foo Fighters, Nickleback, papa roach, avenged sevenfold, Five finger death punch, alter bridge, black stone cherry, stone broken, inglorious will that do so far....... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 1 minute ago, Cuzzie said: Foo Fighters, Nickleback, papa roach, avenged sevenfold, Five finger death punch, alter bridge, black stone cherry, stone broken, inglorious... No, he said 'world class rock bands'. *Gets taxi to airport, flies to south America, hides in hot smelly cupboard in Venezuela* 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I live in Venezuela.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Just now, Cuzzie said: I live in Venezuela.... D'OH! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 15 minutes ago, Cuzzie said: I live in Venezuela.... Check your cupboards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted December 11, 2017 Author Share Posted December 11, 2017 31 minutes ago, Cuzzie said: Bas, To name a few from mid nineties onwards Foo Fighters, Nickleback, papa roach, avenged sevenfold, Five finger death punch, alter bridge, black stone cherry, stone broken, inglorious will that do so far....... Who? Haha you've illustrated my point perfectly, thanks the Cuzzie Now The Who - they were a proper band! Check album and rock concert sales for The Who just by themselves and see if that doesn't add up to more than all the 9 bands you've listed combined? If I'm wrong, I promise to get a decent compression pedal before the first half of 2018 is out...(and I will do anyway if compression is indeed a very significant part of the 'valve amp magic' that sets valve amps apart from SS ones). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBP Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 (edited) Don't get me wrong, I love The Who, but I'm pretty sure that the Foo Fighters alone out sell them these days. As ever though I could be wrong... Edited December 11, 2017 by JBP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted December 11, 2017 Author Share Posted December 11, 2017 25 minutes ago, JBP said: Don't get me wrong, I love The Who, but I'm pretty sure that the Foo Fighters alone out sell them these days. As ever though I could be wrong... For sure. These days. In the same way as folk are no longer buying Bing Crosby. But I'm talking about all time sales. And yes the Who were around a lot longer but I'm pitting them against Cuzzie's NINE mid / late 1990s bands, so it's defo a fair fight! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Bas You are a being a bell end luddite! not saying The Who aren’t world class by the way, but I suppose you will trot out Dexi’s midnight runners in a bit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuzzie Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Excellent, bell end doesn’t get autocorrected! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 3 hours ago, Al Krow said: Who? Haha you've illustrated my point perfectly, thanks the Cuzzie Now The Who - they were a proper band! Check album and rock concert sales for The Who just by themselves and see if that doesn't add up to more than all the 9 bands you've listed combined? If I'm wrong, I promise to get a decent compression pedal before the first half of 2018 is out...(and I will do anyway if compression is indeed a very significant part of the 'valve amp magic' that sets valve amps apart from SS ones). http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/bass/bass6066.html http://www.thewho.net/whotabs/gear/bass/bass7174.html So all valve gear then, no surprise at all, all of which is by its nature compressing the signal the harder you drive it, and lets face it Mr E liked to drive his gear hard. So in answer to the OP's question The Who use compression by the nature of their amplification choices on stage from the early days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 (edited) Compression has been used as an effect since the late 70's at least. before then it was just baked in to the amps being used to provide bass backline anyway, but after that point you start to see higher powered transistor amps, and alongside them compressors. Tony Levin pretty much made his name in pop with ultra compressed tones:- http://steveadelson.com/interview_levin.php Edited December 11, 2017 by 51m0n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonteee Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Gratuitous Tom Jones-esque thrusting there by Mr Gabriel... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 21 minutes ago, Tonteee said: Gratuitous Tom Jones-esque thrusting there by Mr Gabriel... But the compression in those trousers, I mean, thrusting is baked in with those.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 (edited) @51m0n... Where is the bass sound coming from in that clip when he's got both hands off the bass..? Echo box..? Hidden bass player..? Backing track..? (No, surely not a backing track..! ) Just curious, is all. Edited December 11, 2017 by Dad3353 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonteee Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Having just re-watched the video, I concur. Seems Mr Levin was acting here more in the role of performer, unless the instrumentation has been re-dubbed on in post-production. Four or five different times I spotted where he wasn't playing but the line was there - or was playing something markedly different to the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 12 minutes ago, Dad3353 said: @51m0n... Where is the bass sound coming from in that clip when he's got both hands off the bass..? Echo box..? Hidden bass player..? Backing track..? (No, surely not a backing track..! ) Just curious, is all. Where abouts in the video? Note that the audio isnt entirely synced to the video, I can try and find a better quality clip if you like.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 (edited) Or indeed an even worse video off the same tour... Edited December 11, 2017 by 51m0n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 How about live in 88 then? The point stands, there is a tonne of bass compression for effect (and an OC2 octaver) to make that particular tone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 And anyone citing direct injection to the board as a sign of compressionless bass in the studio is handily forgetting both tape compression and mastering compression, which have always been applied since the early 60's. Motown were flabbergasted at the level of various Beatles tracks on 7" singles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 7 minutes ago, 51m0n said: Where abouts in the video? Note that the audio isnt entirely synced to the video, I can try and find a better quality clip if you like.... 1m40, again at 3m00. The video is synched OK, as can be seen from the singing. Odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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