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The most musically talented musician of all time

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Marcus Miller. Hundreds of album credits, scored dozens of soundtracks, multi instrumentalist, composer, producer, incredible body of solo work, played with a whose who of top class musos, and of course he 8s rather handy on the bass. Seems like a pretty decent chap too.

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Guest bassman7755
12 hours ago, chris_b said:

OK. Name some women who fit into the most musically talented category.

kate bush ?.

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3 hours ago, Bilbo said:

How about Richard Bona? Pat '17 Grammys' Metheny? Or the new kid on the block, Jacob Collier? There are so many, it is impossible to choose. As for Prince and Michael Jackson. Entertainers, yes, but most musically talented? Can't see it. 

As I see it, if you stop 10 random people on the street then at least 5 should have heard of the person for them to qualify for worlds most talented, being a muso's musician doesn't cut it for me. Having cross genre appeal is a good pointer too, if someone can make you appreciate them even when you dont especially care for the genre then they must have a very special level of talent (and I guess that correlates with mass appeal). So on basis I guess the obvious picks are McCartney Elton etc.

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The greatest is entirely subjective.

The most influential of all time?

In the western world my vote would go to the classical greek who first developed harmonised choral singing, or the 5th century AD monks who perfected it and discovered and formalised the scales and chords we still use today.

We don't know their names, but they're the ones who set us on the path to harmonised instrumental accompaniment, leading to everything from the three piece punk band to the full orchestra and everything in between.

Edited by Cato
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If you are thinking about virtuoso players then classical guitarist John Williams springs to mind as does pianist Oscar Peterson.  My wife is a classical oboe player, used to most of the classical repertoire, and she cannot bring to mind any female composers from that era.  Modern day, I would echo the mention of Carole King as a great contemporary composer and Diane Warren.  Burt Bacharach deserves a mention plus the Irving Berlins, Cole Porters and Gershwins of this world.  In short we are spoiled for choice so let's just enjoy their genius!

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48 minutes ago, LeftyP said:

If you are thinking about virtuoso players then classical guitarist John Williams springs to mind as does pianist Oscar Peterson.  My wife is a classical oboe player, used to most of the classical repertoire, and she cannot bring to mind any female composers from that era.  

I love John Williams's playing.

 

I mentioned female composers earlier. It's only very recently that it was considered 'suitable' for women to make a career in composition. Mendelssohn's sister was a very accomplished composer, but she had to publish under her brother's name. Similar to authors of the period.

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On 01/12/2017 at 00:11, bassman7755 said:

As I see it, if you stop 10 random people on the street then at least 5 should have heard of the person for them to qualify for worlds most talented, being a muso's musician doesn't cut it for me. 

That's a nonsensical, illogical stance though. But I give you that if you stop 10 random people on the street, at least 5 will agree with you. In the real world however, the most talented musician most probably (almost but not wholly by definition) will be known by, and understood by, very few. The moment you people want to educate your kids, and think that newborn babies have little knowledge, is the moment your popular view has become a falsehood. Cue the Triangle of Knowledge.

People who think that Paul McCartney is the most talented musician ever simply have no clue, and when they attack people like me for being condescending, they are in fact being arrogant themselves. It's the Dunning-Kruger effect at large.

Edited by BassTractor
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2 hours ago, BassTractor said:

...Queue Cue the Triangle of Knowledge...

[Pure Pedantry] Fixed [/Pure Pedantry] ;)

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5 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

[Pure Pedantry] Fixed [/Pure Pedantry] ;)

Thanks, Dad. I was gonna like that, but computer says no. ("Sorry, you cannot add any more reactions today." - an unexpected feature of the new feature.)

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Guest bassman7755
8 hours ago, BassTractor said:

 In the real world however, the most talented musician most probably (almost but not wholly by definition) will be known by, and understood by, very few.

The real rare talent that marks someone as having extraordinary musical ability is being able write songs that become iconic, that become part of our culture, musicians who can play clever and complicated stuff are ten-a-penny.

 

Quote

People who think that Paul McCartney is the most talented musician ever simply have no clue, and when they attack people like me for being condescending, they are in fact being arrogant themselves. It's the Dunning-Kruger effect at large!

So its OK for you to call other people clueless but noone is allowed to criticise you. Your lack of social calibration is I guess the reason youve got it all so wrong.

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Actually further confusion, musically talented immediately brought to mind for me compositional skills rather than actual playing.

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28 minutes ago, bassman7755 said:

 

29 minutes ago, bassman7755 said:

The real rare talent that marks someone as having extraordinary musical ability is being able write songs that become iconic, that become part of our culture, musicians who can play clever and complicated stuff are ten-a-penny.

Actually, people who can write hit classics are ten-a-penny, and that's why there are millions of hit classics on this planet. People like Bach, Mozart and Penderecki are extremely rare. Me, I love thousands of hit classics, and my iPod is filled to the rim with stuff you might appreciate - ranging from death metal to Spice Girls to Beatles to Prince to the Dixie Dregs and other already mentioned artists.

However, the hit classics seldomly have been written by the most talented musicians ever, which is what the thread was about. I still love them and appreciate these songs for what they are. I do not need to dream up myths about them in order for them to become valuable enough. For example, I love the Beatles and have every album from Rubber Soul and on - but one. Paul McCartney still ain't no Bach. 

BTW, there's this little quick-and-dirty litmus test: ask Penderecki and McCartney to analyse and critique each other's work... You'll soon find that Penderecki immediately sees the strenghts and weaknesses of Sir Paul's output, where Sir Paul will not be able to even start analysing Penderecki's work.

Yes, I'm aware that that is not of value to you. Your story is somewhat more like this: if by a weird coincidence a newborn child cries loudly and it somehow becomes a hit classic, then this newborn child is mentioned by at least 5 of the random people you stop in the street, and this newborn child then logically is way more talented than Penderecki ever was... :D

I call BS. Sorry about that. 

 

30 minutes ago, bassman7755 said:

So its OK for you to call other people clueless but noone is allowed to criticise you. Your lack of social calibration is I guess the reason youve got it all so wrong.

Actually, in any part of life, I am always open for any criticism. You and I have never met, and I do not expect you to believe me, but what counts to me is trying to find something that has some value and some truth, and I like to find this stuff in a (fighting if need) collaboration with other minds. If that truth reveals my weaknesses, then I've learnt something and have received a clue as to what I need to work on. Criticise me all you want, but I do prefer it when people who criticise me base their input on facts and reasonable analysis.

My calling people clueless may have been misguided, but does not come from a vacuum. It stems in part from some form of truth (Paul McCartney is a talented person who has written many songs that the general public can love (me included) but not more than that, and in 300 years he'll not have the status that Bach and the like will still have), and it also stems from observing the loudmouths on this planet for six decades and seeing how badly they treat the talents on this planet - talents who often accept this maltreatment in silence because they understand how the talentless function. When I wrote my above post, I was a bit fed up, and also remembered another thread that I sadly couldn't find and link to. I was unsure whether I should post, but the being fed up won.

Your remark about my social calibration is the typical use-of-hastily-found-stick that I'm not too enthusiastic about (not that it was a particularly heavy stick).

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essentially, never confuse popularity or success  with talent. Just look at U2, Spice Girls, Britney Spears, One Direction etc. I rest my case

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Assuming 'musically talented' encompasses the ability to compose tunes of some complexity as well as proficiency in playing many of the instruments (including voice) necessary to perform them, in modern times I'd nominate;
Paul McCartney
Stevie Wonder
Todd Rundgren
Peter Frampton
.. probably in that order

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16 hours ago, TheGreek said:

 

The man could play virtually everything and could make 'em all groove...

Go back and listen to any of his work...guaranteed to blow your mind.

I know the last time I said something about not liking Prince's work, I got slagged off. I still don't like the vast majority of what I've heard of his. Like a latter-day Paul McCartney. Still, while it's OK to say what you like about Coldplay or U2, Prince is sacrosanct so I suppose I'll get slagged off again. I won't deny he's composed a lot of stuff and could play lots of instruments, but I'm not convinced of the merit of what he's composed.

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8 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

[Pure Pedantry] Fixed [/Pure Pedantry] ;)

No, he was right. Please stand in line and wait your turn :)

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23 hours ago, wateroftyne said:

Women?

Starter for ten: Aretha. Joni. Kate Bush.

Sheryl crow has it all too

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Just like to add that anyone who plays a fretted bass (or any other equal temperament instrument) is influenced by J.S. Bach whether they know it or not :D. But people these days prefer to bang on about some modern fad like the Beatles......hell in a handcart I tells ya. B|

 

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