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Looping stuff that probably doesn't exist...


NickD
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I've a feeling I'm $hit out of luck here without making things much more complex than I want, but here goes.

I love playing with the looper on my B3 but I'd like something less restrictive, and that I could use live with a drummer. Ideally I'd like something that I could build multiple loops on, that I could switch in and out for A/B/C sections, and that could also output a click via headphones to keep us together. Does anyone know of such a device, or am I looking at laptops, software and racks of complicated shizzle?

Cheers

Nick

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I think the laptop or iPad route could be a good one.

It's possible to set up a DAW as a looper and make use of all the effects and time keeping functionality.

Here's an example that comes to mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2793YThvhlM

You could use a fairly basic MIDI controller to start, stop, undo etc. Ok, so it will mean you'd need an interface too, but pick the right one and you can start sending FOH mixes and separate headphone mixes to band members. On the subject of interfaces, I really love my Focusrite Clarett as it comes with a remote control app for my phone or iPad that can also adjust levels for IEMs etc. very cool.

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Thanks Dan!

I feared that would be the case, and I don't think I can be bothered with that. I do have an interface with which I use Cubase, but I can't see me ever taking that kind of setup to a gig. I was hoping that a click output was a feature I'd missed when browsing for loopers, then a little mixer to split it. Ah well, back to the drawing board.

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[quote name='NickD' timestamp='1495458548' post='3303863']
Thanks Dan!

I feared that would be the case, and I don't think I can be bothered with that. I do have an interface with which I use Cubase, but I can't see me ever taking that kind of setup to a gig. I was hoping that a click output was a feature I'd missed when browsing for loopers, then a little mixer to split it. Ah well, back to the drawing board.
[/quote]

Fear not, I mean the Digitech loopers do have a click track on board and I think the Stereo Looper they do will allow you to send a click to a separate output. I'm pretty sure of that anyway!!

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Great stuff, I'll have a look into that.

If I can keep it simple, just feet and fingers, I'm all over it. I know it works for some and the results are more controllable, but I don't want to be relying on software and faffing about. I want it to be simple, so we can just play, but obviously I'd like us to be in synch.

Many thanks!

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[quote name='NickD' timestamp='1495459399' post='3303870']
Great stuff, I'll have a look into that.

If I can keep it simple, just feet and fingers, I'm all over it. I know it works for some and the results are more controllable, but I don't want to be relying on software and faffing about. I want it to be simple, so we can just play, but obviously I'd like us to be in synch.

Many thanks!
[/quote]

I'm pretty sure there will be other possibilities too and expect that somewhere out there will be something that will fit the bill perfectly :)

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I certainly hope so. I've been looking round this week and couldn't find anything that explicitly stated this capability. It seems like a no brainer to me, I can't be the only one who would find this useful.

Thanks again!

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[quote name='NickD' timestamp='1495460612' post='3303884']
JamMan Stereo... It does, it only bloody does!

I'm on it, Cheers! :D
[/quote]


Yessssssssssssssssssssss! :) That's great. I started questioning my memory afterward, so I am very pleased we have a result!

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[quote name='elephantgrey' timestamp='1495488709' post='3304224']
If it's one of the jamman that uses jamsync, there's a box you can buy called a syncman that will sync it up to midi.
[/quote]

Whaaaaaa? I had no idea! I have the XT solo with the sync connectors. I must go check this out! THANKS!

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[quote name='dood' timestamp='1495538470' post='3304520']


Whaaaaaa? I had no idea! I have the XT solo with the sync connectors. I must go check this out! THANKS!
[/quote]

I use one with my jamman express. I needed a small/cheap looper that syncs to midi for the start of my chain, and this was the only solution I could find.
Makes the jamman lime actually useable for me (just imo).

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Wondering whether the Boss RC 30 might be a good starting point for live use? Has 99 separate loop memories and the twin pedal arrangement should provide additional flexibility for introducing fills etc. all without breaking the bank?

Edited by Al Krow
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Thanks everyone for your input... man I love this place (as long as I stay out of Off Topic of course).

I'll have a look at the RC30 too. The fundamental thing is being able to output a click, and ideally switching between different loops just to be able to stretch a groove out into a bit more of a tune. It doesn't need to be a proper midi thing as all I want to synch is 2 or 3 people, just so we're together.

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[quote name='Sibob' timestamp='1495544338' post='3304604']
Boss RC300?
Headphone out (whether that sends click or not I don't know), three distinct channels.

Boom
Si
[/quote]

No headphone out on the RC 30 but it does have a USB out and crucially, for me, is also £250 cheaper than the RC 300 :)

I think both the RC 30 and RC 300 have a rhythm output which I guess you can use as your click track? And importantly you can change the tempo of looped phrases without changing the pitch, which is pretty cool.

Edited by Al Krow
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[quote name='elephantgrey' timestamp='1495541657' post='3304563']
I use one with my jamman express. I needed a small/cheap looper that syncs to midi for the start of my chain, and this was the only solution I could find.
Makes the jamman lime actually useable for me (just imo).
[/quote]

The problem I had was that I really wanted to mount all of my pedals in a rack and still have access to even basic looping functionality. My board at my feet being a MIDI controller of sorts meant that I'd still have a looper out in front of me completely negating the plan to have less cables running around my feet. Maybe this would have been the solution.

All of the gigs I've played recently have been possible without a pedal board but in the future I'll get something together; if the looper is on the board then I expect I'll be looking at the SyncMan too!

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  • 1 month later...

[quote name='TrevorR' timestamp='1495538098' post='3304516']
This sounds a lot like the Looperlative gear that Steve Lawson used to use... [url="http://looperlativeaudio.com/"]http://looperlativeaudio.com/[/url] Don't know what the status of the company is these days...
[/quote]

That's all doable on the Looperlative, though the click would be an audio channel that you record, and then just sync everything else to it as multiples of that... I've done it a few times, though these days I tend to just send a whole submix of the loop-stuff to the drummer if they want it, so that they can hear it all and adapt to whatever weird rhythmic strangeness is going on :)

As for the status of the Looperlative, it's currently out of production, but is going back into production very soon, I gather - check the facebook page :)

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*sneaks back in and bows down at the feet of the looping God... probably embarrassing him somewhat in the process*

Thanks Steve.

For the simplicity I want I'm looking at th Jam man stereo atm... just trying to get security clearance from my Wife. If it works out though I'd like to get a little more complex. Small steps and all that, but the more ideas drummer and I come up with the more I hear different parts but don't want to go beyond a 3 piece.

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Warning - I've not tried this but as a suggestion, you could use the new MS-3 with a looper pedal to set-up and layer different loops with effect combinations. It's not cheap but it's got a ton of switching options...

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[quote name='NickD' timestamp='1499272559' post='3330457']
For the simplicity I want I'm looking at th Jam man stereo atm... just trying to get security clearance from my Wife. If it works out though I'd like to get a little more complex. Small steps and all that, but the more ideas drummer and I come up with the more I hear different parts but don't want to go beyond a 3 piece.
[/quote]

that sounds like a lot of fun - I'd definitely recommend making sure the drummer can hear what you're looping, perhaps more importantly than either of you hearing a click - so long as (s)he's got a good headphone mix of the loop stuff, you should be OK. Especially if you have time to practice... I never practice with anyone, only do gigs, so there's a whole other level of knife edge there, but as it's all improvised, the set up can 'fail gracefully' - if the drummer can't hear rhythmic loops well enough, I just don't use them.

The last option, which you may find enjoyable, is to mic up the drums and loop both of you - I've been doing this a lot recently with Andy Edwards - we have a duo live album that's currently subscriber-only over at Bandcamp ( http://stevelawson.bandcamp.com/subscribe ) but has quite a few points in it where I loop both of us together, and even a bit in one piece (the last one, I think) where I'm looping and manipulating his drums as a duet with his live drums :D

Some of it is on video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qL3BnCjIr-I - see if you can work out which bits are looped drums ;)

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Thanks again Steve, I'll refer back to your points as we get into it.

Your right, it's fun already, and I'm incredibly excited at the idea of developing it further. Although we're talking about pretty low levels of ability here, the sounds we make are already interesting to me.

I'll check out your stuff, been meaning to subscribe for ages. All the stuff I have of yours are downloads from Amazon, which I suspect benefits neither you or I!

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[quote name='NickD' timestamp='1499442648' post='3331624']
Thanks again Steve, I'll refer back to your points as we get into it.

Your right, it's fun already, and I'm incredibly excited at the idea of developing it further. Although we're talking about pretty low levels of ability here, the sounds we make are already interesting to me.

I'll check out your stuff, been meaning to subscribe for ages. All the stuff I have of yours are downloads from Amazon, which I suspect benefits neither you or I!
[/quote]

I did get paid when my stuff was on Amazon (I've removed it, I'm not into supporting tax evasion ;) ) but they took a hefty chunk... The Bandcamp stuff works out at MUCH less per album for you to pay (initially it's 30 albums PLUS everything in the next 12 months, for £20. Thereafter it's everything in that year for the £20... which last year was 7 albums :) ) - and it's way more sustainable for me not having to 'market' individual albums, but being able to focus on a body of work that reflects just how much amazing stuff can happen when you spent your life improvising ;)

Thanks for the support - I REALLY appreciate it. And I'm looking forward to hearing what you and your drummer get up to!

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