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Jus Lukin

By Jus Lukin,
in Amps and Cabs

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Happy Jack Grand Master

Happy Jack

Posted
Posted

Oh no, you've gone and started them up all over again Pete!

Maybe the solution is to print out all the bickering, scrunch it up really small and stuff it in our ears. Then we wouldn't need to worry about trivia like how these cabs (Barefaced or any other) actually sound.

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stingrayPete1977 Grand Master

stingrayPete1977

Posted
Posted (edited)


Oh no, you've gone and started them up all over again Pete!

Maybe the solution is to print out all the bickering, scrunch it up really small and stuff it in our ears. Then we wouldn't need to worry about trivia like how these cabs (Barefaced or any other) actually sound.



I keep a pointy stick for barefaced threads, when it goes quiet I give them a prod :lol:


Tbf that is the claim made that the barefaced fans above said they couldn't see anywhere. Edited by Dad3353
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EBS_freak Grand Master

EBS_freak

Posted
Posted (edited)


Oh no, you've gone and started them up all over again Pete!

Maybe the solution is to print out all the bickering, scrunch it up really small and stuff it in our ears. Then we wouldn't need to worry about trivia like how these cabs (Barefaced or any other) actually sound.


What's wrong with discussion? Is Barefaced off limits or something?

There's no bickering - there's conversation about the claims made by Barefaced and whether they actually stack up. Let's not forget that the Barefaced products are not insignificant money - and in my book, that does not make discussion about them trivial, especially when there are claims being made about the products that may, or may not be questionable.

Of course, there is an easy solution... if you want don't want to participate in conversations like this... don't! :P Edited by Dad3353
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Happy Jack Grand Master

Happy Jack

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Posted (edited)


What's wrong with discussion? Is Barefaced off limits or something?



Oh no, Barefaced is not off limits. It's just witch-hunts that I find tiresome.

Alex isn't a childhood friend of mine, and I don't own shares in his company, so I have no personal axe to grind here. I'd be equally as disappointed in "the community" if it chose to hound remorselessly Warwick Basses or Eden Amplification for perceived reliance on ... yuk ... marketing speak.

But you don't, do you? You don't try to start a fight with Warwick or Eden, or Fender or Markbass or whoever because they're not Basschatters, they don't waste their time trying to engage with Basschatters, and frankly they couldn't give a rat's derrière what you think.

Can you imagine Stevie sending his graphs to Aguilar and Bergantino and trying to point out the errors in their marketing claims? Actually, I can. And I can easily imagine the response he'd get from those companies.

Alex is a Basschatter who actually put his money where his mouth is. He reckoned he could make a better bass cab than most on the market, got criticised to hell and back for daring to make that claim, so he just went off and succeeded. Were you one of those who mocked him back in 2007? Was Stevie? I neither know nor care, but if you really want to "take on" Alex then all you need to do is to design your own cabs, start your own businesses, and compete with him.

Wouldn't that be a much fairer fight? Then, instead of challenging him for his snake oil and false claims, you could prove him wrong by out-selling him in the market place. Or not, as the case might be.

But if you really think it all works better if you sit back in your chair accusing him of daring to change his mind occasionally (are you and Stevie particularly proud of having never once changed your minds on any topic, I wonder?), and if you genuinely believe that you are making a valuable contribution to the Basschat community by trying to drive Alex away, then you must do whatever you think appropriate.

I shall now give you back your playground. Edited by Dad3353
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EBS_freak Grand Master

EBS_freak

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Posted (edited)


Oh no, Barefaced is not off limits. It's just witch-hunts that I find tiresome.

Alex isn't a childhood friend of mine, and I don't own shares in his company, so I have no personal axe to grind here. I'd be equally as disappointed in "the community" if it chose to hound remorselessly Warwick Basses or Eden Amplification for perceived reliance on ... yuk ... marketing speak.

But you don't, do you? You don't try to start a fight with Warwick or Eden, or Fender or Markbass or whoever because they're not Basschatters, they don't waste their time trying to engage with Basschatters, and frankly they couldn't give a rat's derrière what you think.

Can you imagine Stevie sending his graphs to Aguilar and Bergantino and trying to point out the errors in their marketing claims? Actually, I can. And I can easily imagine the response he'd get from those companies.

Alex is a Basschatter who actually put his money where his mouth is. He reckoned he could make a better bass cab than most on the market, got criticised to hell and back for daring to make that claim, so he just went off and succeeded. Were you one of those who mocked him back in 2007? Was Stevie? I neither know nor care, but if you really want to "take on" Alex then all you need to do is to design your own cabs, start your own businesses, and compete with him.

Wouldn't that be a much fairer fight? Then, instead of challenging him for his snake oil and false claims, you could prove him wrong by out-selling him in the market place. Or not, as the case might be.

But if you really think it all works better if you sit back in your chair accusing him of daring to change his mind occasionally (are you and Stevie particularly proud of having never once changed your minds on any topic, I wonder?), and if you genuinely believe that you are making a valuable contribution to the Basschat community by trying to drive Alex away, then you must do whatever you think appropriate.

I shall now give you back your playground.


There is not a witch hunt. Lets make that clear.

And lets face it, any product that has me questioning it's claims, gets me asking questions. You only have to look at the Smooth Hound thread to see my points about latency. This isn't personal digs... this is my comment on the specs of the product and it's performance. I've done the same with Sheldon Dingwall and mixed scaled lengths. I've done the same the same with Ashdown. I've done the same with EBS. I've done the same with Ernie Ball. Thats just a small selection - I could continue... but any company that is waving wares in front of my face in a bid to get me to buy should expect to be questioned. I think you are mistaken if you think that Barefaced is being singled out - there have been similar discussions all across the forum by lots of different members about all sorts of products... Ashdown, Shuker, Rickenbacker, Dr Bass, Warwick, DR... there are plenty of examples if you choose to open your eyes. Some manufacturers and even some retailers choose to sign up and respond - that's their right. Alex chooses to respond - and as such, if he enters into conversation, he should expect some interaction and further questions.

I can't imagine Stevie sending his graphs to the manufactures like you suggest... but what I can imagine him doing, is posting it up on a forum and corresponding with the appropriate parties if they choose to get involved in the discussion. I don't believe Stevie has emailed anything directly to Barefaced... but then again, I wouldn't know, I'm not his keeper.

2007 - I don't give a rats about anybody's home projects... if somebody wants to build a cab, all power to them. That's great. I don't believe I have mocked anybody's projects, let alone Alex's Big One build. What I do have issue with, is what I witnessed shortly afterwards when it turned into a commercial project... which was the way that the marketing of that cab, The Big One, claimed it would solve all problems for all players. In fact, I remember witnessing Alex being quite derogatory about player's gear and other brands. Anyway, a bass cab that required at least a 1k Watts was actually adding to the problems of people with pre-existing gear. I didn't like the idea that guys with 500W amps were struggling to power their new cab. If you didn't get the results out of his cabs, it was down to your playing style, your bass, your pickups, your strings... But hey.

You mentioned that he went off and succeeded - isn't the fact that these type of threads exists questioning whether he did in fact succeed?

Things have moved on - but the claims are still wild. I still see that nobody has commented on the 18inch Sub that I have mentioned numerous times. BF claim - on their website - that it keeps up with a typical 2x18 cab. Bearing in mind, on paper, it would take 3 BF subs to keep up with one of my 18 inch subs, I'm amazed that a claim that it will keep up with a 2x18 can be made - and it has certainly got my attention. It should be pointed out that a typical 2x18 cab could be expected to achieve 140dB or just under for it's max SPL. Yes, the BF sub is super light for a 18 sub... but a high output (remember - as loud as a 2x18), lightweight sub is the holy grail... and I refuse to believe that Barefaced are the first people that have managed to develop such a thing. The max SPL they are claiming is the first pointer that things don't appear to be quite as they seem. There's companies out there spending untold amounts of money in research in this area. Perhaps BF have nailed it... but then again, none of my questions have been acknowledged let alone answered. But hey, the attacks on me are always guaranteed.

I don't need to build cabs for a living. I don't want to build cabs for a living. I make more than enough money without going down that path. Hell, I want to BUY cabs. But I also feel I should be informed about the cabs that I am buying. That wouldn't be unreasonable right?

Happy Jack - I think you need to chill out. You have a Barefaced cab. I get it. Enjoy it. If you aren't interested in the science behind the claims, keep out this playground. Edited by Dad3353
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EBS_freak Grand Master

EBS_freak

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Posted (edited)


I must admit I've never understood the concept of why someone should have to make their own better version of anything to be allowed to question a manufacturers specs?


Ah. Time for the old classic!

Rolls-Royce.

BHP: Enough

:P Edited by Dad3353
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stingrayPete1977 Grand Master

stingrayPete1977

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I'm going over to beardchat.co.uk to challenge Gillette on this ridiculous statement.
[attachment=245485:152_LBOT-19.jpg]



Try comparing their twin blade razor to a single blade one! You can't comment on the results or any packaging claims until you have your own range of razors in the market place though ;) Edited by Dad3353
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Raggy Rising Star

Raggy

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Try comparing their twin blade razor to a single blade one! You can't comment on the results or any packaging claims until you have your own range of razors in the market place though ;)



:D ;) Edited by Dad3353
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EBS_freak Grand Master

EBS_freak

Posted
Posted (edited)
stingrayPete1977 said:


Try comparing their twin blade razor to a single blade one! You can't comment on the results or any packaging claims until you have your own range of razors in the market place though ;)


Watch out for my razor build in the projects section.

My resulting single razor will be comparable to typical double bladed razors.

Ridiculous isn't it?

Edited by Dad3353
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EBS_freak Grand Master

EBS_freak

Posted
Posted (edited)


The thing is though, they were right. I mean, you couldn't argue with that claim.


Those old Rollers were hardly sufficient when fully laden and going up a 1:3. It's a true story - I thought I would have to get out and push the old girl up that hill. Edited by Dad3353
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