Finished! A Bridge Too Far?

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='Paul S' timestamp='1492168017' post='3278408']
Good for players with small hands.
[/quote]

That as well

I reckon it's pretty close to Mick's original design brief. I always said to him that there may need to be compromises for practicality reasons but heck, it's: offset; white; light; eye-catching...

What more could he possibly want?


Miracles??

[Andyjr1515]

Back to reality - on something like this, it is well worth prototyping. You get to understand the best way to go about things and can 'design on the hop' way before allowing chisels, drills or routers anywhere near the precious body or neck wood.

I was fully expecting for a 'back to the drawing board' moment but actually this[i] seems[/i] to work extremely well.

Stringing up is a breeze - quicker than stringing up a standard bass:[list]
[*]Feed the string through the back fretboard hole
[*]Capture the ball in the tuner block with a couple of turns of the tuner
[*]Feed string end through the headstock hole
[*]Pull tight and clamp with the allen grubscrew
[*]Bend over 90 degrees
[*]Pop the double clamps on
[*]Trim the excess string
[*]Couple more turns of the tuner brings it up to pitch
[/list]
The other thing is how strong this arrangement seems to be:[list]
[*]The strings simply pull the tuner block tight against the body blocks in line with the force - no vector angles involved
[*]Likewise, the strings are simply trying to pull the back block through the headstock.
[/list]
The final advantage is that the headstock can be absolutely any shape at all.

If all the above is true, I'm well chuffed. If you see the fatal flaw I've probably missed, please do let me know before I start cutting maple!

Edited April 14, 2017 by Andyjr1515

[TheGreek]

[quote name='Andyjr1515' timestamp='1492167792' post='3278406']
And out comes the hacksaw again :



And we have two strings strung up! I would have been 4 but my pretend fretboard was too narrow

Here's the tuner block:


...and here's the double clamp at the pseudo headstock:



...and here's the whole thing:



So, just need to pop on a couple of strap-locks and a quick wipe-over with tru-oil and ship it off to Mick: job done

I'm quite pleased and am sure that Mick will be. Didn't think I'd be able to get this close to Mick's original shape...and it's soooooooooo light!










[/quote]

I knew this wasn't it - it's fretless and I wanted fretted...you won't outsmart me that easily.

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1492173189' post='3278470']
I knew this wasn't it - it's fretless and I wanted fretted...you won't outsmart me that easily.
[/quote]
That made me laugh out loud

[TheGreek]

For those reading the http://basschat.co.uk/topic/303895-euromillions-l86m-tonight/ thread, Andy DOESN'T CHARGE £7M PER BASS!!

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1492186499' post='3278580']
For those reading the http://basschat.co.uk/topic/303895-euromillions-l86m-tonight/ thread, Andy DOESN'T CHARGE £7M PER BASS!!
[/quote]
Yes he does if the customer's just won the Euromillions

[TheGreek]

You're relying on the old adage "[i]a fool and his money are easily parted[/i]"..

[rOB]

As usual. Great fun to watch you work. Thanks for sharing.

[MoonBassAlpha]

Just as a point of note, I'd make sure that the screw threads on the tuners are well lubricated, I used a copper grease. If it's anything like the Steinberger licenced ones on the Hohner Jack bass, they can get stiff and wear out eventually failing. I've fixed a few now using 4mm Helicoil type inserts into the sliders. These are stainless and will last forever. I'd consider doing this as a preventative measure, unless your bridge is very high quality like ABM where the sliders are brass.

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='MoonBassAlpha' timestamp='1492340273' post='3279479']
Just as a point of note, I'd make sure that the screw threads on the tuners are well lubricated, I used a copper grease. If it's anything like the Steinberger licenced ones on the Hohner Jack bass, they can get stiff and wear out eventually failing. I've fixed a few now using 4mm Helicoil type inserts into the sliders. These are stainless and will last forever. I'd consider doing this as a preventative measure, unless your bridge is very high quality like ABM where the sliders are brass.
[/quote]
Yes - good tip. One of the tuners is already suspiciously stiff when tightened any distance and I may need to run a die or tap along it in any case (I think it's a bit of powder-coat on the thread), but I'll grease them as you suggest

[Andyjr1515]

Final thing to sort before I start gluing and cutting properly is the hidden magnetic pickup.

The challenge here is that the body is very thin to start with and gets thinner very quickly as you move away from the centre-line. Add to this the challenge of getting the coil as close to the strings as possible and you can probably see where I'm coming from.

The original concept was this:


I did some experiments with various metal bits (slugs and bars) laying across the top of the pickups of my fretless and came to a number of conclusions:[list]
[*]Built-in adjustable slugs are better than close proximity metal as pictured above
[*]If it IS separate, then a rectangular iron bar across the top of the pickup is better than individual slugs
[*]All of the above do increase the volume, but you still need the coil itself to be as close as possible to the strings to get the tone as well.
[*]The ideal pickup therefore needs to have adjustable slugs, be narrow and be slim
[/list]
So Mick's MEC, nice though it is, is probably not the one.

Here's how wide and deep it is compared with, say, the mini pickup for an EB-3:



It extends way past the width of the fretboard, reducing the maximum pickup height by a few mm, it is 28.5mm deep against 19.5mm of the mini humbucker (the body depth at the centre is likely to be 30mm max) and doesn't have adjustable slugs. My fear is that any advantage of a nice pickup would be lost - and some - by the extra distance it would be from the strings.

My thoughts at the moment, if I can't find anything else, is to use the adjustable slug version of the above mini & that I fitted to Pete's EB-3 style build last year:




The curve of the body top in the drawing below is exaggerated for illustrative purposes but I think it explains what I mean....:


I'll do a bit more thinking and research and then bounce the options off Mick.

And then it's SAWDUST TIME, FOLKS!!!!

[Andyjr1515]

OK - hidden magnetic pickup proven.

Forgive the tatty softwood prototype, but this is broadly how the mini-humbucker would fit at the back, with a flush cover matching the neck splices:




...and then from the top without the fretboard fitted - and remember that the real one will have screw poles:




Then for the fretboard - to cut a channel for the pole pieces to screw out without breaking through the fretboard top - the old carved archtop trick:


Which means, even in this soft knotty pine, I can cut a slot within 1.5mm of the radiused fretboard top:



So now imagine the pole-pieces have been raised 2-3mm, nestling in the slot just cut :


...and we have:[list]
[*]A fretboard flush with the body carve
[*]The main coil c. 7mm from the strings
[*]The coil slugs c. 4mm from the strings
[/list]


I reckon that will do it

[TheGreek]

With my last build from Andy I couldn't wait for the next update...with this one I know that the more I wait, the closer I am to the finished product, whether it's because he's solving potential problems or manipulating wood...







You boy!!...yes, you with the smutty mind!!...back of the class now!!

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1492448477' post='3280336']
With my last build from Andy I couldn't wait for the next update...with this one I know that the more I wait, the closer I am to the finished product, whether it's because he's solving potential problems or manipulating wood...







You boy!!...yes, you with the smutty mind!!...back of the class now!!
[/quote]

[Andyjr1515]

The sound of steel on wood :


...and all of a sudden we have something that looks like a bass :

[TheGreek]

Het Andy

Info you asked for on it's way to you....

[Joebethell]

Just a thought and might not be a good idea but have you seen the round individual coil pickups that were used by Gordon Smith(think it was the gypsy bass) so you could adjust each strings response. Maybe someone could replicate a version of this to give you adjustment with the coils closer to the string?

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='Joebethell' timestamp='1492525154' post='3280926']
Just a thought and might not be a good idea but have you seen the round individual coil pickups that were used by Gordon Smith(think it was the gypsy bass) so you could adjust each strings response. Maybe someone could replicate a version of this to give you adjustment with the coils closer to the string?
[/quote]
Yes - good thought and I did look at something like this as a fallback option.

My conclusion was that, if I could get close enough with conventional I would go with that, but if I couldn't, then something of that nature would have been a worthy option to investigate. I think with the distances I am able to achieve, then conventional [i]should[/i] be fine.

[Andyjr1515]

Mick has sent me the neck profile measurements of his favourite player so that, as far as possible, I can replicate the general 'feel':



Ahead of gluing anything together, I've also done some sketches to get my head around how the single-cut transition of the neck will work:



In the meantime, I've done a bit of work to the neck - routing the truss rod slot and band-sawing the taper. Single cuts throw an interesting challenge ref the taper, more of which later when you see what I'm planning with the fretboard

[JPJ]

That tuner assembly is just crying out for a nicely carved piece of neck laminate in behind it 'wedge' fashion

[TheGreek]

I wish you hadn't said that...planted all sorts of ideas in my head...I think you may be right.

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='JPJ' timestamp='1492617388' post='3281694']
That tuner assembly is just crying out for a nicely carved piece of neck laminate in behind it 'wedge' fashion
[/quote]
[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1492617519' post='3281698']
I wish you hadn't said that...planted all sorts of ideas in my head...I think you may be right.
[/quote]

I'm ahead of you both....already planned

[TheGreek]

See...told you Andy was a genius.

[Andyjr1515]

[quote name='TheGreek' timestamp='1492618157' post='3281708']
See...told you Andy was a genius.
[/quote]
Ah....but only if we are talking about the same thing....otherwise Andy is probably a bit of a letdown

I'm assuming you both mean here:

[TheGreek]

I thought that JPJ meant an ornate wedge supporting the back of the bridge - possibly glued to the back of the neck. Correct me if I'm wrong.