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Al Krow

By Al Krow,
in Bass Guitars

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Munurmunuh Grand Master

Munurmunuh

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Maria Callas and KJ have completely different set of vocal chords. It's a pointless comparison.

 

It's not that they've different vocal chords – to make that point, I would have posted Callas and Joyce DiDonato – the point is that Callas is operating to much tighter tolerances than KJ: the notes are clearly articulated, not just smudged over; the tone is naturally resonating, not something artificially plumped up by the sound guy.

 

So as a comparison it's very much to the point: exactly the same music, delivered at different price points.

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Al Krow Grand Master

Al Krow

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Soz mate - don't follow your logic at all here.

 

If the "instrument", i.e. vocal chords in this instance, the singers are using are the same - which they are not, no two singers have the same vocal chords, albeit siblings can sometimes come pretty close - you're now talking about how the singers are using their instruments. The comparison would be to say that a top class bass player is going to play the same bass better than Joe Average. No debate from me on that.

 

But as I said, if you think you can hear a difference in sound from the same bassist playing a 2024/5 vs 1024/5 in a band mix, on a bass with pretty identical design, pups, woods and preamp (and assuming of course the same strings) you're welcome to spend the extra if you think it's worth it. Happy to disagree and I hope you enjoy your 2024 when you get one, I'm sure they are lovely basses 🙂

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Munurmunuh Grand Master

Munurmunuh

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6 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

you're now talking about how the singers are using their instruments

.....which then equivalates to how the manufacturers of the 1024 and the 2024 use their tools. Degrees of quality are everywhere.

 

The reason I gave two performances of the same specs was because I was appealing to your understanding as a musician that the same thing can be done to two do levels of quality, in the hope that you would be able to see that the Katherine Jenkins in the large Indonesian factory will not be producing the same quality of work as the Maria Callas in the small Japanese factory.

 

As a matter of interest, when you played a 2025, was it after you had bought and got to know your 1025? I can appreciate that once you've grown to know something, the qualities of something similar become harder to care about.

 

 

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TheGreek Grand Master

TheGreek

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Anybody who attends Bass Bashes will know that even we Bass players struggle to identify instruments, even when they're our own.

 

Check out the various tests at the SE and Herts Bashes for more info. In short, we might like to think we can hear the difference but in reality we're nowhere near as good at it as we think.

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Al Krow Grand Master

Al Krow

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On 19/09/2021 at 22:45, Dean Vincent said:

I've scoured this thread in the past for insight into this 1024/2024 question!

All I'd say is that there are posters earlier in the thread who say they see a big difference. And Al who says he sees no difference at all.

So the answer is it's in the eye ear of the beholder 👍

Fixed 😊

 

Did you end up getting one or both?

 

Just to clarify I am very much NOT saying there is no difference at all. Maybe best I summarise where I have landed on this 2024/5 vs 1024/5 topic :

  • the 2024/5 is the recipient of two sonic treatments which are designed to give the bass a "played-in" feel from day 1. A 1024/5 will also get a played-in feel, after it's been err...played-in, which comes for free from using the bass;
  • the 2024/5 is MI-Japan vs 1024/5 MI-Indonesia. The cost of labour in Japan is significantly higher, which will lead to a higher product cost. But Indonesia has got a pretty good rep for making quality basses e.g. Ibby SR Premiums costing £1k+ are MI-Indonesia;
  • pretty much everything else about the basses are the same - design, pups, woods, preamp and bridge;
  • for the record I have not heard the 2024/5 A/B'd in a blind test with the 1024/5, played by the same bass player with a full band - that would be a key test for me. But tbh I'm not expecting to hear anything much difference between two pretty identical basses played by the same bass player and if I can't hear any difference, I sure as heck wouldn't dream of paying three times as much. Others are free to come to a different conclusion and spend their hard earned cash how they wish! 

In case any of you have never so much as laid eyes on either a 1024/5 or a 2024/5 - here's a decent A/B "bedroom" comparison of the 5 string versions. Recommend a good pair of headphones and to just listen without watching the clip - can you tell them apart (even without a full band blaring)?

 

 

I guess my thinking these days is that once we have "good enough" kit, spending more money on gear is not going to make us sound any better. That will instead happen only as we become better bass players by spending time on technique, practice and, if we get the chance, regularly playing live with capable bandmates. 

 

Edited by Al Krow
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Muzz Veteran

Muzz

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I've had a 1024 and played a 2024, and the 2024 was definitely a superior instrument (though a real 'sleeper', as it looks the same), but, given the huge rise in quality of cheaper instruments from just about anywhere, the higher up the price range, the more subtle the differences*.

 

I've got a 414, as a replacement for a 3000A I had for a couple of decades; in a band mix it sounds like me, and because of my preferences for slimmer necks and lighter weight, it feels better to play.

 

So really those 1024s aren't worth three times the price of a 414...YMMV... 😁

 

 

* Though my 'best' basses are made-to-spec Shukers, which is a different thing altogether...

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Dean Vincent Community Regular

Dean Vincent

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

 

Just to clarify I am very much NOT saying there is no difference at all.

 

OK, but I think there's a cigarette paper's difference between 'pretty identical' (to use your words), and no difference at all.

 

I don't have either, I'm sticking with my 424 for now 🙂 but I'll probably go for a 734A or a BBP34 when I upgrade.

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Woodinblack Grand Master

Woodinblack

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10 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Just to clarify I am very much NOT saying there is no difference at all. Maybe best I summarise where I have landed on this 2024/5 vs 1024/5 topic

 

So to put it in another way, if you walked into a shop where everything was free and you could have anything you want but never sell it so there were no value or financial concerns at all in play, would you not pick the 202x over the 102x?

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Munurmunuh Grand Master

Munurmunuh

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To be clear, I've never so much as laid my eyes on either a 1024 or a 2024, but I have enough performance experience to know that differences in feel are worth noticing even when there's no difference in sonic result. I've performed unamplified in many different venues. Sometimes the space's acoustics make it a breeze to perform there and sometimes the acoustics make the whole thing a struggle: sometimes there's no bloom to the sound; sometimes, to overcome a soupy acoustic, your articulation needs to be more crisp. From the audience's point of view, the resulting sound is no different, but the pleasure of performing in the different venues varies enormously, as compensating takes effort and sucks up your attention. 

 

So when I imagine a very talented bassist faced with a 424 and a 1024 and a 2024, I'm sure they'll make all three of them sound wonderful, their personal tone transcending each instrument's limitations, but I would also expect them to prefer the one that requires less effort from them, the one where the instrument almost feels like its playing itself. Just because the Indonesian Yamaha factory is good – and I wish my Squier P had been made there – does not mean that there won't be perceptible differences in the MIJ version, even if it's hard to put them into words.

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AndyTravis Grand Master

AndyTravis

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20 minutes ago, Ricky Rioli said:

 

When I read 414 and Orange in the URL I had a horrible worry it was yours. Never been glad to read 'Stowmarket' before.

No. No. It’s staying. I’d want £7000 and a Wal to swap.

 

sb-55 off to @briansbrew tomorrow have offered the 350 fretted to a select few and blue Tune is now listed everywhere in the world ☹️
 

Still on the fence with red. Clever bass that.
 

 

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krispn Veteran

krispn

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Posted
20 minutes ago, Dean Vincent said:

The 2024s are very rare though - has anyone played the 734/5A and the BBP34/5 and noticed a difference in quality, feel, sound etc? (Disregarding the pre-amp)

There’s at least two for sale on here just now 😀 
 

 

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Munurmunuh Grand Master

Munurmunuh

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1 hour ago, Dean Vincent said:

The 2024s are very rare though - has anyone played the 734/5A and the BBP34/5 and noticed a difference in quality, feel, sound etc? (Disregarding the pre-amp)

 

38 minutes ago, krispn said:

There’s at least two for sale on here just now 😀 

 

BBP34: might break your neck, might not

 

BB2024: <snap>

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