Jump to content
Why become a member? ×

Muse - Knights of Cydonia


TommyK
 Share

Recommended Posts

So this may have been covered before but i cant find it if it has....

I'm depping for a local band who do this track. If you don't know it...:[url="https://youtu.be/z9D71pQaTnc"]https://youtu.be/z9D71pQaTnc[/url]


The galloping/triplet verse bit at the start.... 0:49 - 2:40.... For the musically ignoramus (i.e me) What is going on here? I thought it was in E minor to start with but it seems to change key almost at the end of each measure? ... or is it just starting in a different place? Or am i just being thick?

I've learnt it by ear and written it down which is fine, i've played it live with them 3 times fine and the 4th time ballsed it up cos i got lost with my reading.... oops... (Also they play tuned down half a step which doesn't help me at all when i get lost!)

I cant seem to memorise it, if i knew what was going on it might help me perhaps?

Thanks kindly
TK

Edited by TommyK
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So it looks to me like it's pretty much the exact same progression, it just changes key so if you learn the fingering, you should be fine, just move it up and down the neck!

Bear in mind I'm not too sure of the theory behind this myself, and while I think the chords are right, I'm not sure I've put it in the right key. To me it looks like it goes from Em to Cm then to Abm. Can anyone confirm whether it should be Abm or G#m? It was the chord of G in the Abm section that was confusing me, so I decided to put it in Abm.

[attachment=220977:Knights of Cydonia - Bass.pdf]

Edited by Higgie
Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465317109' post='3067083']
So it looks to me like it's pretty much the exact same progression, it just changes key so if you learn the fingering, you should be fine, just move it up and down the neck!

Bear in mind I'm not too sure of the theory behind this myself, and while I think the chords are right, I'm not sure I've put it in the right key. To me it looks like it goes from Em to Cm then to Abm. Can anyone confirm whether it should be Abm or G#m? It was the chord of G in the Abm section that was confusing me, so I decided to put it in Abm.

[attachment=220977:Knights of Cydonia - Bass.pdf]
[/quote]

Yep, begins in Em, modulates to Cm, Abm(G#m) and finally back to Em. I spotted a Bm at bar 15 which should be major.
I would analyse it like this: [attachment=220978:KNIGHTS OF CYDONIA.pdf]

~Joe

Edited by Joebass
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I transcribed this a few years ago and can confirm it cycles backwards in jumps of two tones: Em > Cm > Abm* >Em. It reminds me of a Shadows number!

*As a bass/guitar player, I find it much easier yo read in G#m than Abm!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465321399' post='3067139']
Ah! Yeah didn't realise I'd put that as Bm. D'oh! Is there any general consensus as to whether it's Abm or G#m? Does it make a difference?
[/quote]

They're just enharmonic equivalents, no right or wrong but most people find it easier to read 5 sharps than 7 flats.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465317109' post='3067083']
G in the Abm section that was confusing me, so I decided to put it in Abm.
[attachment=220977:Knights of Cydonia - Bass.pdf]
[/quote]

The G chord is part of a modulation and is derived from E minor. On your transcription, you should be changing to E minor at bar 59.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I did think G#m would be easier to read, and would also avoid all the Cb and Fb nonsense, but seeing as it had gone to Cm I thought I'd keep things flat instead of jumping between #s and bs! If there's no actual "Correct" answer then fair play. So in my transcription I'm changing key too late... Is that just because the chord is derived from Em? If that bar was a chord from G#m/Abm would the key change technically be the next bar then? Is it just common practice to change key as soon as you get to a chord that is not diatonic?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465323417' post='3067183']
Is it just common practice to change key as soon as you get to a chord that is not diatonic?
[/quote]

No, non-diatonic chords are used all the time (Neopolitan, Augmented Sixth etc.). If you respell the Fb and Cb as E and B, you should see a clear progression in Eminor.

Here's my brief analysis:

The main theme consists of 2 phrases, each phrase is made up of 8 bars. The first (Question) phrase is in E minor, ending with a modulation into Cmin for the next (Answer) phrase. After a short 4 bar interlude, the whole sequence repeats, transposed up a minor 6th/ down a major 3rd.

Edited by Joebass
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for your posts they've been very helpful! I'm curious as to why it's a chord of D# in bar 8 of the second page? I get that it is setting up the modulation that will follow, but why wouldn't it be an Eb?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465330963' post='3067314']
Thanks for your posts they've been very helpful! I'm curious as to why it's a chord of D# in bar 8 of the second page? I get that it is setting up the modulation that will follow, but why wouldn't it be an Eb?
[/quote]

It's not setting up the modulation, it [i]is [/i]the modulation. The D# has a clear dominant function leading to the G#m, an Eb here would obscure that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Higgie' timestamp='1465334340' post='3067370']
I see, so why doesn't the key signature change 2 bars earlier instead of having the accidentals leading up to it?
[/quote]

It's just common practice. It's better to have the new key signature coincide with the double barline/new musical section; it adds visual clarity to the form.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[quote name='Joebass' timestamp='1465322426' post='3067159']
They're just enharmonic equivalents, no right or wrong but most people find it easier to read 5 sharps than 7 flats.
[/quote]
True, but if it is doing tertiary modulations, i.e, moving by major third, then the 'spelling' would by Abm rather than G#m, but agree doesn't matter too much. Beethoven did tertiary modulations, so it's not new!

Edited by zbd1960
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good point :)
You would have to change the spelling somewhere, though.[list]
[*]Em - Cm = Tertiary
[*]Cm - Abm = tertiary
[*]Abm - Fbm?
[/list]
I guess you could change from Abm to G#m going into the new section.

Edited by Joebass
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...