"Boys Night Out" Is This The New Niche For Bands?

[blue]

[quote name='Cato' timestamp='1448967809' post='2919602']
Hasn't there always been an element of 'boys night out' with bands?

My first couple of bands were definitely like that, a group of mates playing music together, partially because we enjoyed making music but also because we enjoyed socialising together.

Trying to impress girls (with the emphasis on 'trying') was a pretty big motivator as well.

I probably wouldn't want to join a band that mentioned beers and chuckles in the ad these days but then I'm no longer a drinker, as long as the band isn't awful I don't think there's any harm in taking that approach.

It's probably more healthy than the guys who get stressed because they take it far too seriously.
[/quote]

I am stressed, I barely make enough to cover my monthly bills. However, this type of stress I love because I'm in control of it. This is way less stressful then the stress I had when I was in the "rat race", the corporate 9-5 push push world.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1448999505' post='2919994']

My gigs are more jobs for the boys rather than boys night out.
[/quote]

I'm proud to say my band is a business and I look at it as a job. Funny, when I'm at the gas station filling up ($1.89 a gallon) on a gig night, the folks that work there will say:

[i]"Hi Blue, what are you up to tonight?"[/i]

And I'll say, [i]"I'm going to work." [/i]And they say, "[i]Yeah, where are you playing tonight?"[/i]

I love it!

Blue



Blue

[blue]

[quote name='Iain' timestamp='1449007180' post='2920096']

Like the rest of the guys I make my living in my day job.
Like the rest of the guys I live for the playing.
[/quote]

That's cool, and you guys have families and other interests.

Me, this all I have in life and really all I ever wanted. I play bass guitar and sing for people that pay me money.

Blue

[Dad3353]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1449031538' post='2920225']
That's cool, and you guys have families and other interests.

Me, this all I have in life and really all I ever wanted. I play bass guitar and sing for people that pay me money.

Blue
[/quote]

There's a down side to all of the above, of which you're edoubtless fully aware, related well in the old 'all your eggs in one basket' adage. While that basket holds, all is well. A spot of ill health, a market switch, a falling out with close colleagues and there's the rug pulled out from under one's feet. I assume that this has been accepted long ago, and that you've managed to avoid walking on the cracks too much; long may that continue. Most folks prefer, in many matters, a bit more diversity, but, as you rightly say, we're all different. My profesional career(s) were spent avoiding specialisation, which enabled me to always land on my feet and jump sideways if I wished. It's not safe, becoming an expert; one can quickly become out-dated.

Edited December 2, 2015 by Dad3353

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Heket' timestamp='1449002530' post='2920035']
Honest question, if rock is on the decline, what do you feel is on the upswing? What's "new"? Pop or indie stuff? Electro genres? Any music that gets people dancing is good surely, so what about disco and funk?
[/quote]

I honestly don't know...though that may be partly down to my ignorance of modern chart music, and it's a very good question in any case! I'm tempted to say that it might be Ed Sheeran and Mumford clones - "nice young men" with acoustic guitars and just the right amount of facial hair. The best indicator is usually the heavily manufactured model the record company pops out within six months of a fad becoming popular, and I think Sam Smith's sudden appearance is probably the result of the big labels trying to create their own Mr Sheeran.

[Mykesbass]

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1449048811' post='2920281']
I honestly don't know...though that may be partly down to my ignorance of modern chart music, and it's a very good question in any case! I'm tempted to say that it might be Ed Sheeran and Mumford clones - "nice young men" with acoustic guitars and just the right amount of facial hair. The best indicator is usually the heavily manufactured model the record company pops out within six months of a fad becoming popular, and I think Sam Smith's sudden appearance is probably the result of the big labels trying to create their own Mr Sheeran.
[/quote]

Cheap and easy to develop in the first stages - two guys with acoustic guitars can probably get two or three gigs a week and run an open mic session or two every month. Less cost to landlord, less intrusive, so can fit in as background music, and without meaning to sound disparaging as it isn't meant that way, it appeals more to people who wouldn't go out specifically for music.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Mykesbass' timestamp='1449051577' post='2920304']
Cheap and easy to develop in the first stages - two guys with acoustic guitars can probably get two or three gigs a week and run an open mic session or two every month. Less cost to landlord, less intrusive, so can fit in as background music, and without meaning to sound disparaging as it isn't meant that way, it appeals more to people who wouldn't go out specifically for music.
[/quote]

This is a very good point - it's a good way to almost gig by stealth! You can't really put a rock band into a pub discreetly, and you do seem to be increasingly at risk of setting off the punters who just think that live music is a nuisance.

I just wish some of the acoustic-bangers would be a bit more adventurous - Ian Siegal, for example, is living proof that one man and a guitar can be incredibly engaging, so what's stopping so many of the others?

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1449064011' post='2920468']
...and you do seem to be increasingly at risk of setting off the punters who just think that live music is a nuisance.
[/quote]

The Finsbury is a reasonable small venue near me, with a proper stage, PA and dedicated sound guy. They have live music most nights from a varity of generes to a decent standard. The music area is cordoned off from the rest of the pub by a sliding door which is kept closed to stop the music getting into the actual pub and annoying people. Average friday night, ten people or so watching the bands and a good hundred or so in the bar having a chat...

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1449064011' post='2920468']
I just wish some of the acoustic-bangers would be a bit more adventurous - Ian Siegal, for example, is living proof that one man and a guitar can be incredibly engaging, so what's stopping so many of the others?
[/quote]

The reason the vanilla whinging strummer man bun brigade is so popular is that they are not engaging at all... and therefore can be easily ignored.

Edited December 2, 2015 by CamdenRob

[Mykesbass]

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449065084' post='2920484']


The reason the vanilla whinging strummer man bun brigade as so popular is that they are not engaging at all... and therefore can be easily ignored.
[/quote]

Got to be a contender for the Basschat Famous Quotes thread!!

[Jonnyboy Rotten]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1448932278' post='2919424']
Nobody tells me what I have the time for or how I spend my time.

Blue
[/quote]

No - and neither do most of us here who have partners. You say it like you think we are some kind of prisoners in our own home?

When we are choosing how to spend our time we have to consider other people and their arrangements. The difference is for most us - that is our partners and family. For you it is your band members.

[blue]

[quote name='Jonnyboy Rotten' timestamp='1449065650' post='2920495']


No - and neither do most of us here who have partners. You say it like you think we are some kind of prisoners in our own home?

When we are choosing how to spend our time we have to consider other people and their arrangements. The difference is for most us - that is our partners and family. For you it is your band members.
[/quote]

Good point, as a matter of fact except for me all the band members travel with us. And 2 work for the band. They all seem happy and get along well.

Me, I guess I never caught on to the whole relationship thing. I've been divorced for over 20 years.

However, I'd be hard to convince that a young guy with a family is going to have free reigns to bar gig all weekend.

Blue

Edited December 2, 2015 by blue

[Mykesbass]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1449072470' post='2920565']

However, I'd be hard to convince that a [s]young[/s] guy with a family is going to have free reigns to bar gig all weekend.

Blue
[/quote]

I've been lucky there, my wife isn't really into going out and loves being at home with the kids, so evenings are pretty much ok for me. It is weekend daytime that is completely off limits, that's family time.

[blue]

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449065084' post='2920484']


The Finsbury is a reasonable small venue near me, with a proper stage, PA and dedicated sound guy. They have live music most nights from a varity of generes to a decent standard. The music area is cordoned off from the rest of the pub by a sliding door which is kept closed to stop the music getting into the actual pub and annoying people. Average friday night, ten people or so watching the bands and a good hundred or so in the bar having a chat...
[/quote]


That separate room for the band in some cases really shows you what many punters think of live music.

It can be the kiss of death anytime there is distance between the band and the bar.

Blue

Edited December 2, 2015 by blue

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1449073794' post='2920579']
That separate room for the band in some cases really shows you what many punters think of live music.

It can be the kiss of death anytime there is distance between the band and the bar.

Blue
[/quote]

Yes it's terribly sad to see, whenever I'm in there I feel bad for the guys perfroming.

I can underatand why the landlord has it set up that way though, it's a young crowd mostly <25 who are out for a chat with their mates and have no interest in live music.

As a music fan I would always check out a band if they were on in a pub I was visiting... .. but then again that's mostly because i'm not very friendly and prefer listening to music than talking to people

[Heket]

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1449074495' post='2920586']
As a music fan I would always check out a band if they were on in a pub I was visiting... .. but then again that's mostly because i'm not very friendly and prefer listening to music than talking to people
[/quote]

Lol, that sounds familiar I'm friendly but not very loud, plus I don't drink so whenever things get a little lairy I'm usually off to the dancefloor/music area. We don't have an awful lot of live music in my area but it's better than some places, especially rural parts. I know one place does a fortnightly open mic, there's a blues club which books gigs for Saturdays and a couple of the pubs on the high street do live music weekly when there isn't football/seasonal parties/other events.

And yeah no, if any partner tells me what I'm allowed to spend my time on they can bite my shiny metal hi-mass bridge. I don't have kids though, which helps.

[TimR]

I joined a 'Boys night out band' after leaving a 'Boys night out band' because the new band had gigs lined up and the old band were being more and more selective over which gigs they wanted to do.

It was also becoming obvious that the old band was also pretty much made up of people who just wanted to be able to say to their mates that they were in a band.

The gigs for the new band dried up pretty quickly and after many conversations about getting out at least once a month it became pretty obvious that they weren't interested in even one a month. Meeting once a week to run over old tunes away from home was pretty much all they wanted to do.

I'm more careful about which bands I play with now.

.

Edited December 2, 2015 by TimR

[blue]

[quote name='TimR' timestamp='1449100679' post='2920842']
I joined a 'Boys night out band' after leaving a 'Boys night out band' because the new band had gigs lined up and the old band were being more and more selective over which gigs they wanted to do.

It was also becoming obvious that the old band was also pretty much made up of people who just wanted to be able to say to their mates that they were in a band.

The gigs for the new band dried up pretty quickly and after many conversations about getting out at least once a month it became pretty obvious that they weren't interested in even one a month. Meeting once a week to run over old tunes away from home was pretty much all they wanted to do.

I'm more careful about which bands I play with now.[/quote]


This is a good lesson for all, especially those new to bands and gigging. You should know what type of band your looking for from genre, gigs to money. You should also make sure the band is actually what they say they are. Beware of verbiage like;
[list]
[*]We have industry connections
[*]We have gigs on the books
[*]We want to be gig ready by by March 2016
[*]We're all veteran players
[/list]

More times than not it's pure rubbish. I say OK, prove it!

Blue

[CamdenRob]

[quote name='Heket' timestamp='1449087296' post='2920726']
Lol, that sounds familiar I'm friendly but not very loud, plus I don't drink so whenever things get a little lairy I'm usually off to the dancefloor/music area
[/quote]

The dancefloor ...just thinking about having to dance makes me feel uneasy... nothing ends a night out for me quicker than the mention of a dancefloor... it inevitably leads to everyone I am with dancing, and therefore me being expected to dance, even though everyone I know knows I have never and will never dance. Why do people always assume that after a lifetime of refusing to dance this time will be different?

[quote name='Heket' timestamp='1449087296' post='2920726']
...I'm friendly but not very loud...
[/quote]

I'm just unfriendly

Edited December 3, 2015 by CamdenRob

[2 left thumbs]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1448917178' post='2919217']
Hi,



I been at this bass guitar, rock and roll thing for 50 years now. I'm fortunate to be in band with a really nice book of business (bars, clubs, functions, festivals and fairs) with good, honest and trustworthy organization. We play about 75 shows per year.



Blue
[/quote]
[quote name='blue' timestamp='1449026423' post='2920211']
It's tough but I have been on both sides of the fence, the 9-5 corporate side and now the ful time rock musician. At 62 I'm finally at piece and I'm really enjoying life now. Finally doing something that I know how to do.

You have to constantly work at having money coming in.

Now keep in mind I'm single with adult children out on their own.

Blue
[/quote]

practice every other week, we only do the gigs we want to do. none of that "can you turn down they can't hear coronation street in the back room" bullshit


for me gig count way down this year, due to unfortunate circumstances 4 months of nothing
only 11 gigs this year, lowest payers £50 biggest £250 averages out at about £77 per gig
according to google the average uk salary is £26,500 per year. to make that at £77 per gig
i would have to do 344 gigs per year to make an average living in the uk
to make the same money doing 75 gigs a year, the gigs would have to pay an average of £353.33
seeing as thats not going to happen any time soon, think i'll stick to the day job have a decent standard of living, and enjoy my boys nights out.
is it any wonder that bands are so keen to make it in america

[ead]

Will change my footer thingy to Boys Nights Out rather than bands. I'm clearly a rank amateur and my lack of commitment is entirely the fault of having to work for a living.

[TimR]

[quote name='2 left thumbs' timestamp='1449128509' post='2920896']



practice every other week, we only do the gigs we want to do. none of that "can you turn down they can't hear coronation street in the back room" bullshit


for me gig count way down this year, due to unfortunate circumstances 4 months of nothing
only 11 gigs this year, lowest payers £50 biggest £250 averages out at about £77 per gig
according to google the average uk salary is £26,500 per year. to make that at £77 per gig
i would have to do 344 gigs per year to make an average living in the uk
to make the same money doing 75 gigs a year, the gigs would have to pay an average of £353.33
seeing as thats not going to happen any time soon, think i'll stick to the day job have a decent standard of living, and enjoy my boys nights out.
is it any wonder that bands are so keen to make it in america
[/quote]

You're not comparing like to like though. How many of those gigs are 11 hours door to door? If you took an 8 hour day with an hour for lunch and an hour each way travel gives you £9.26 an hour pro-rata or £12.75 an hour if you just count the actual hours.

Even if you play solid for 3 hours that's an average of £25.66 an hour.

So it depends on how you value your time.

Also £26,500 is average. The median (what most people get paid) is quite a bit lower.

[KevB]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1449026423' post='2920211']
It's tough but I have been on both sides of the fence, the 9-5 corporate side and now the ful time rock musician. At 62 I'm finally at piece and I'm really enjoying life now. Finally doing something that I know how to do.

Blue
[/quote]

So could you still live at the same standard of living you have purely from the gigging irrespective of having done a day job for years or is the gigging effectively topping up the pension or savings you accumulated from doing that day job for years?

[Skol303]

Blue, I think your perception on this is obviously swayed by the fact that what you do for a living - i.e. pay your way by playing in a band - is the [i]exception[/i], rather than rule, for the majority of people who own bass guitars.

Just as being a professional sportsperson is the exception for someone who owns a football, or a bicycle, or a set of golf clubs. Only a minority of people choose - and succeed - in making careers out of such things.

The different between “a boys night out” and “being in a band”? You seem to define this based on whether the musicians are earning their crust from playing music (and so need to play frequently); whereas I think most people would more simply define a “band” as being a bunch of people playing music, period.

Other than that, I’m not sure what question is being asked here. Is being a professional musician better than not being one? Too many variables for that to have any kind of sensible answer: not least how much money you want (or need) to earn and where music sits in your list of life’s priorities, especially when measured against family.

The only distinction to be made here is that some musicians are full time; other are part-time; others still are purely hobbyists. All are musicians.

Still... an interesting thread!

[TimR]

I think it's more about how seriously you take being in a band, or any other hobby where other people are affected by your choices.

Being in a band means everyone should be on the same page. There's nothing wrong with treating it as a 'boys night out', as long as the whole band are in agreement.

[mingsta]

Blue, I enjoy your posts and this has been an interesting thread. But the way your OP read it had the air of asking "how much do you gig, and why?" then bigging yourself up on account of your 75 gigs a year, while looking down on those who aren't living that life. I'm sure that's not what you meant, but its certainly how you came across. You probably could have done the first two things, but skipped the last 8o)

I'm a working stiff/hobbyist and can speak from that perspective. For many a hobbyist just getting to the point where you are doing 1-2 paid gigs a month is already a good achievement. I've reached my glass ceiling and I'm happy in my greenhouse! If I had more time for music, I'd put more time in to expanding myself creatively/musically rather than necessarily doing more gigs. We have a growing setlist of about 40 songs, and it'd start to do my nut in if we were bashing out the same songs 1-2 times a week. Music is quite far down my list of priorities so I'm just massively thankful to be in a set up that works well and where we get a semi-regular stream of gigs 1-2 times a month.

The only reason I do it is because I enjoy the pressure and release of performing live and because its massively rewarding (satisfaction, not money!) to be paid in recognition of this. For most of us its not glamorous or cool being in a band at all, so its certainly not for that! When we play weddings and parties you're just some dude carrying heavy boxes and running cables for 50% of the time, then the other 50% of the time you're at the back with the drummer while the singer and guitard lap up the glory. So no, far from being a Boys Night Out...not by a long shot...