Do I want to sell my Bergs and go Barefaced?

[discreet]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1381440930' post='2239311']
[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I've never known a single brand to polarise people so much. You get brands that people aren't keen on all the time but it's rare for people to have such a strong dislike of a brand's core sound.[/font][/color]
[/quote]

Polarised is right. I borrowed a Super Twelve for a few months and I liked it very much. Not heard the 3rd Gen stuff yet, but I was blown away by the S12 and will be buying a BF cab ASAP. I can't imagine how anyone who's heard one wouldn't like it! Horses for courses and all that, I suppose.

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='pietruszka' timestamp='1381439727' post='2239278']
I'd strongly recommend looking at TKS cabs. My personal experience is they have far more thicker, fuller and beefier bottoms end. Not to mention cheaper if you go for the ceramic ones. The build quality is outstanding as well and their range is more an options list and you build your cabs from that.

WoT has 2 and loves them, like I say, from personal experience the tks wipes the floor with many other 112's. If not all!


Dan
[/quote]

Yip - [i]absolutely[/i] worth a look. [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/212014-tks-engineering-cabs-new-to-the-uk-review/"]More here[/url].

[molan]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381441138' post='2239315']


Polarised is right. I borrowed a Super Twelve for a few months and I liked it very much. Not heard the 3rd Gen stuff yet, but I was blown away by the S12 and will be buying a BF cab ASAP. I can't imagine how anyone who's heard one wouldn't like it! Horses for courses and all that, I suppose.
[/quote]

I agree - lots of people on BC seem to really rate them so they must work for them.

Meanwhile I saw a one demo'd recently against a well known brand and several people were pulling ugly faces because they didn't like the sound.

It's this extreme polarisation that I don't understand really. Usually when you hear a few things back to back you'll get people preferring one brand to another because of smaller differences but with BF you seem to get this big love/hate thing going on.

I've genuinely met people who were nearly frothing at the mouth about how much they dislike them but then here on BC there's obviously a huge love for BF.

It does seem quite common for people to buy them and then sell again soon after so there must be some core tonal characteristics that just grate on certain people very quickly. You often see this with basses but not so much with cabs so that's what intrigues me I guess

[Musicman20]

[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1381436263' post='2239210']
Why? I'm not being confrontational, just interested in your thoughts.
[/quote]

A) Resale, B ) Bergantino sound - Jim has an excellent approach to bass guitar tone in cabinets, C) Aesthetics, D) Quality.

Edited October 10, 2013 by Musicman20

[wateroftyne]

FWIW, I've gigged a Compact, a Vintage and a ceramic prototype that probably isn't going into production. Enjoyed all of 'em.

[Raggy]

I went form Berg to Barefaced and I have not looked back, at all, since. You to hear some bleat on about looks but I tend to stand with my back to my cab

There is now doubt the Bergs are damn good cabs, but Barefaced are better IMO.

But as said before, have a listen and look first if you can.

[pietruszka]

They are worth a listen to! Don't get me wrong! But I do think there are a lot better out there. It's all very well having this spec and that spec, but as the old saying goes, it's all in the fingers. After my experience with bf cabs, I was left feeling underwhelmed. And that's all, they're not bad cabs but they're not as good as my mark bass. Or Aguilar cabs and definitely not as good as the tks. If I was given one I wouldn't be upset, just happier with something else.

A few people have mentioned the finish on bf cabs. I have to agree, I think the finish isn't as good as a lot of other manufacturers. Paying a premium price for something that looks like it's covered in hammerite is not something I'd be happy with.



Dan

[Toasted]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381439835' post='2239281']
Do you think it's because people in the real world like to hear with their eyes?
[/quote]

No - I think it's because a lot of people in the real world have expectations of premium products and one of those is fit and finish.

[nottswarwick]

Get the bf as you have a month trial or money back. Keep the bergs and trial the bf, and then sell the bergs or return the bf. easy.

[fretmeister]

Clearly I'm going to have to try one, and a Berg CN112.

I definitely want to get the weight down from my current cabs so I will be selling 1 at a time, as I need something to play though and the wife has a massive sense of humour failure on new cab delivery day if a cab hasn't already left the building.

I'll get an advert and pictures up later on. They have been gigged..... with an acoustic orchestra! Not very loud at all!

[wateroftyne]

Another FWIW...

I adore Bergantino. Beautiful cabs. I used HS210s for a number of years, then HT112/ER stack, and then to the TKS.

The TKS felt like home. Sold the Bergs. Never regretted it.

[discreet]

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1381441791' post='2239333']
Meanwhile I saw a one demo'd recently against a well known brand and several people were pulling ugly faces because they didn't like the sound.

It's this extreme polarisation that I don't understand really. Usually when you hear a few things back to back you'll get people preferring one brand to another because of smaller differences but with BF you seem to get this big love/hate thing going on.
[/quote]

Here's my guess: Listening to one brand against another in isolation (possibly in a shop) is no way indicative of how those cabs are going to sound at a gig in a band situation and at battle levels. I found that the S12 I was using sounded [i]absolutely[/i] perfect live, but on its own at home (for example) less so. But of course it's the sound 'in concert' which counts - unless you're Michael Manring, of course.

Basschatters know well that the sound of a rig in isolation has [i]no [/i]bearing on how it will sound 'on the night', so to speak.

Edited October 11, 2013 by discreet

[molan]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381488886' post='2239712']


Here's my guess: Listening to one brand against another in isolation (possibly in a shop) is no way indicative of how those cabs are going to sound at a gig in a band situation and at battle levels. I found that the S12 I was using sounded [i]absolutely[/i] perfect live, but on its own at home (for example) less so. But of course it's the sound 'in concert' which counts - unless you're Michael Manring, of course.

Basschatters know well that the sound of a rig in isolation has [i]no [/i]bearing on how it will sound 'on the night', so to speak.
[/quote]

It was in a large room, not the shop, but was in isolation.

I've always found BF to sound very 'forward' in isolation but have only heard one once in a band mix and it was a bit subdued. Loads of other stuff in the band mix though and it could just have been that it was low in the PA mix.

My personal favourites of the lightweight cabs in a live band situation are the Aggie SL112's. I've heard a few people using these live and never fail to be impressed. However I know some people aren't keen on them and I think they are more sensitive to amp matching than the Berg equivalent.

Just 'horses for courses' really

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381488886' post='2239712']
Here's my guess: Listening to one brand against another in isolation (possibly in a shop) is no way indicative of how those cabs are going to sound at a gig in a band situation and at battle levels
[/quote]

Absolutely. A bass cab is only any use to me when it's in a mix. I try and reserve final judgement on them until I've tried them in a few different live situations.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1381490033' post='2239732']
Each to their own and all that.

To me, Barefaced cabs are staggeringly good.

I'd wager that dissenting voices come from people that (a.) don't like the shock of hearing their pure bass tone (b.) are unused to the cabs' prominent mids. That may come from years of getting used to the mid-scooped tone present in many cabs.

But, for me - nothing cuts through a band mix with such clarity and warmth. And if the cab's mids and highs are too much for your taste, simple - turn down the mids and highs a bit on your amp.
[/quote]well thats a contradiction - either it is their "Pure bass tone" or it's prominent mids cannae be both! Also unless you've got one of those 32 band eqs in your set up it's not going to be as simple as |"turning down the mids and highs on your amp"

[mildmanofrock]

Ah well, pick it apart of you like. It's pretty pure to me - much more than any other cabs I've tried - but, yes - not absolutely uncoloured, that's impossible.

I only have one mid and high control on my amp - does the job perfectly.

But don't listen to me. My opinion means ****-all round here.

Edited October 11, 2013 by mildmanofrock

[molan]

[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1381490033' post='2239732']
Each to their own and all that.

To me, Barefaced cabs are staggeringly good.

I'd wager that dissenting voices come from people that (a.) don't like the shock of hearing their pure bass tone (b.) are unused to the cabs' prominent mids. That may come from years of getting used to the mid-scooped tone present in many cabs.

But, for me - nothing cuts through a band mix with such clarity and warmth. And if the cab's mids and highs are too much for your taste, simple - turn down the mids and highs a bit on your amp.
[/quote]

I'm not having a go at you but it's statements like this that I really don't understand.

Lots, and lots, of people have tried BF and really don't like them - look at how many come up for sale in the classifieds.

However, whenever anyone says they don't really like them there's always a stack if people saying those people must be hearing things incorrectly and/or they don't really know a good bass tone when they hear one.

I just don't see how this could possibly be the case.

[Legion]

I went from a pair of Berg 12's to a Big baby and I have to say I like both. There is certainly a difference in sound though, the Bergs added significant "colour" in comparison to the BF.

It was a very nice sounding colour though.

[discreet]

[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1381490033' post='2239732']
I'd wager that dissenting voices come from people that... ...don't like the shock of hearing their pure bass tone...
[/quote]

Are you implying these people can't actually play bass and have been hiding behind their rumbly muffled 70s-type cabs all this time..?
I'm quite sure that couldn't [i]possibly [/i]be the case!

Edited October 11, 2013 by discreet

[mildmanofrock]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381491676' post='2239764']
Are you implying these people can't actually play bass and have been hiding behind their rumbly muffled 70s-type cabs all this time..?
I'm quite sure that couldn't [i]possibly [/i]be the case!
[/quote]

Not at all. I just think players are used to - and comfortable with - that type of sound.

[molan]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381491676' post='2239764']


Are you implying these people can't actually play bass and have been hiding behind their rumbly muffled 70s-type cabs all this time..?
I'm quite sure that couldn't [i]possibly [/i]be the case!
[/quote]

I think that's exactly what some people think

[discreet]

[quote name='mildmanofrock' timestamp='1381491824' post='2239768']
Not at all. I just think players are used to - and comfortable with - that type of sound.
[/quote]

I'm sorry - I wasn't being entirely serious, as usual.

[mildmanofrock]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1381492211' post='2239780']
I'm sorry - I wasn't being entirely serious, as usual.
[/quote]

No need to apologise.

[IanA]

[quote name='Legion' timestamp='1381491380' post='2239760']
I went from a pair of Berg 12's to a Big baby and I have to say I like both. There is certainly a difference in sound though, the Bergs added significant "colour" in comparison to the BF.
You must mean a different colour of course
It was a very nice sounding colour though.
[/quote]

[alexclaber]

The number of Barefaced cabs being sold secondhand seems remarkably low to me, especially bearing in mind the ones that are sold because the owner is buying a newer/bigger/smaller/different Barefaced cab.

Also, they don't all sound the same - although there are lots of very happy Compact owners we have a lot of customers using other Barefaced models who would absolutely hate gigging with a Compact all the time, they'd never get their sound, not even close! Horses for courses...