Fret lines - Veneer vs wood filler? EDIT

[Dolando]

Hello,

I have a lined ebony fretless neck and the frets on it are painted on white, so have no existing fret slots. Oh, Is there a cheaper alternative to a fret saw, or is it best to use one?

I would basically like to hide these lines a little and make them darker so they're not so obvious. Any advantages in using veneer over wood filler?

Or actually, if anyone knows a way to get the white frets off without damaging the wood that would be ideal.

EDIT - I've just had another look, and it actually has plastic inlays as I can feel the ridge from a fret slot. Really looked like they were drawn on.

So any ideas on where to go from here?

Any advice or experiences on this would be really appreciated.

Thanks,

Adam

Edited December 10, 2012 by Dolando

[3below]

I guess you should be able to sand the lines off with fine paper. An alternate might be gentle application of paint stripper - small amount on a cloth?. Rather than lines, why not insert side dots at the fret positions. You can get away with positions 1,3,5,7,9,12 etc.

[rubis]

Could you stain the lines?

[GuyR]

Whatever you do, don't saw fret slots then fill them. It will be detrimental to the sustain and tone. Best to sand or strip the lines off.

[Dolando]

[quote name='3below' timestamp='1355123109' post='1894245']
I guess you should be able to sand the lines off with fine paper. An alternate might be gentle application of paint stripper - small amount on a cloth?. Rather than lines, why not insert side dots at the fret positions. You can get away with positions 1,3,5,7,9,12 etc.
[/quote]

I did thik about oing it with fine sandpaper. Indont have s rsdius block, so would it be ok if I did it lightly with fine sandpaper? My idea was to actually get rid of the lines in the front and leave the overhang on the top side of the fingerboard as a reference. Kind of a middle ground between fretless with and without lines.

[quote name='rubis' timestamp='1355123550' post='1894247']
Could you stain the lines?
[/quote]

I did try stain the lines with a dark brown dye, left it on for a couple of minutes, but it just wiped off didn't do anything at all!

[quote name='GuyR' timestamp='1355127988' post='1894278']
Whatever you do, don't saw fret slots then fill them. It will be detrimental to the sustain and tone. Best to sand or strip the lines off.
[/quote]

I'd never thought of that, why ruin a nice whole bit of ebony word!?

I might try use a little sandpaper on the overhang underside and see how that goes..what do you think?

[Dolando]

I've just had another look, and it actually has plastic inlays as I can feel the ridge from a fret slot. Really looked like they were drawn on.

So any ideas on where to go from here?

[Dom in Dorset]

[quote name='GuyR' timestamp='1355127988' post='1894278']
Whatever you do, don't saw fret slots then fill them. It will be detrimental to the sustain and tone. Best to sand or strip the lines off.
[/quote]
Sounds like it already has fret slots, as do two of my fretless basses and countless other ones out there. Sustain and tone are fine.
One of my basses had been de-fretted and plastic inserts fitted (looked ghastly) I had to saw them out. If you are trying to hide the lines then some sort of filler will do, if you want nice looking lines use veneer.

[apa]

Or fill with ebony veneer

A

[iiipopes]

Trying to "re-saw" out the plastic fillers is rarely successful, without making a mess of things, leaving traces, having to "fill" nicks in the fingerboard, and such. And the cost of having someone do it just to refill the slots with rosewood or ebony filler strips approaches the cost of a new neck. So if you like the way the bass feels and sounds overall, your best bet is to either live with it or purchase a new fretless neck that does not have markers or fret lines.

[Dolando]

Yea looks like I'll be sawing them out at some point. Is it worth paying for a fret saw? Or is there a cheaper alternative.

I will either be going for something subtle like a dark brown, but I might just hide it with a dark wood filler. I've looked into filling it with veneer, I'm not sure about doing it. I don't want to put too much, or too little veneer in. I have fret dots that I ould also fill with the same filler...

I would like to try leaving lighter markers at the top. Not sure how yet though, would probably have to just mark them with something after.

[Dolando]

I did think about that. Someone was selling an unlined neck but with an ebenol fingerboard. Would like an ebony, Are they similar?

Well I assume mine is ebony, it's made by allparts? Seems like wood to me, does ebenol have a grain?

[Dom in Dorset]

I did it with a jumior hacksaw (or regular hacksaw, can't remember) Took about ten minutes, looked no worse than a de-fretted neck straight after the de-fret. Note this was a rosewood board.
You just put enough veneer to fill the slot, nothing to it.
It's also possible to replace the board if you are feeling adventurous...

Edited December 10, 2012 by Dom in Somerset

[apa]

My experience with ebony is its very odd wood. More like working with charcoal with no grain. Be very carefull - it chips easily.

A

[Dom in Dorset]

Don't worry about too much veneer, leave about 1-2mm stcking out, trim it off with a sharp knife or chissel when the glue has dried.

[rubis]

If the lines are plastic, like the stuff used for binding on a neck or body, then you can melt it with acetone. People do this to fill gaps when binding a guitar. It may then be easier to get out than with a saw
Acetone is also known as nail varnish remover
What ever you decide, be cautious

[Dolando]

I think I'd be ok with the laminating, it's just the removing the plastic inlays that I'm worried about doing. I like the idea of using acetone, as it wouldn't involve sawing into it and possibly chipping the fingerboard. Would it harm the wood if I tried it on a fret? Becaus if it worked ill happily sit there all day so its done carefully.

If I can find a similar neck but with no lines for around the same price I'd be ok with that. It's just finding one....

Really appreciate all the input though.

[3below]

Try a simple low damage method. If the lines are plastic inserts, get a black or brown (depending on ebony colour) permanent marker pen ( [url="http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?hl=en&q=staedtler+permanent+marker&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bpcl=39650382&biw=1092&bih=505&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=6895590855099130917&sa=X&ei=31XGUNSZO4qK0AXL8oDoAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CF8Q8wIwBA"]Staedtler[/url] ). This used carefully will colour the lines for a long time. Re-apply as and when.

[Dom in Dorset]

[quote name='3below' timestamp='1355175495' post='1895137']
Try a simple low damage method. If the lines are plastic inserts, get a black or brown (depending on ebony colour) permanent marker pen ( [url="http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?hl=en&q=staedtler+permanent+marker&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bpcl=39650382&biw=1092&bih=505&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=6895590855099130917&sa=X&ei=31XGUNSZO4qK0AXL8oDoAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CF8Q8wIwBA"]Staedtler[/url] ). This used carefully will colour the lines for a long time. Re-apply as and when.
[/quote]
I use black nylon covered strings on my fretless basses, this solution would probably last forever.

[apa]

[quote name='3below' timestamp='1355175495' post='1895137']
Try a simple low damage method. If the lines are plastic inserts, get a black or brown (depending on ebony colour) permanent marker pen ( [url="http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?hl=en&q=staedtler+permanent+marker&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&bpcl=39650382&biw=1092&bih=505&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=6895590855099130917&sa=X&ei=31XGUNSZO4qK0AXL8oDoAQ&sqi=2&ved=0CF8Q8wIwBA"]Staedtler[/url] ). This used carefully will colour the lines for a long time. Re-apply as and when.
[/quote]

Simple, cheap, effective, repeatable and non destructive. Exellent suggestion. Have a gold star

A

[3below]

[quote name='Dom in Somerset' timestamp='1355177108' post='1895162']
I use black nylon covered strings on my fretless basses, this solution would probably last forever.
[/quote]

I do as well on one of mine, the same set since 1981, seriously. They are still really good. Whether the permanent marker solution will outlast the strings is thus open to debate

[Dom in Dorset]

Staedtler, Berol or sharpie? Come on , it can't be that simple , we need a heated debate.

[3below]

[quote name='Dom in Somerset' timestamp='1355178707' post='1895196']
Staedtler, Berol or sharpie? Come on , it can't be that simple , we need a heated debate.
[/quote]

Is this another Bass forum, am I in the wrong place ? I am told the 10 Vintage Berol is snappier than the 08 Sharpie but only in the higher register.

[Dolando]

Come on people task at hand! Haha

Ill try the sharpie idea and see how that goes I think. Then if a neck pops up I may swap, or if I feel brave enought to remove them. We'll see I suppose.

[Dolando]

The sharpie idea would work, but I was wondering if I could saw out some of the plastic and then add a dark wood filler on top? Do you think this would work? Not as drastic as completely removing them, but would achieve the same result.

Thanks,

Adam

[Dom in Dorset]

You may find that it's no easier (and probably not as neat) as removing them completely. Try one , see how you get on.