What Amp Combo for pubs/small venues etc??

[Mottlefeeder]

[quote name='Linus27' post='133520' date='Feb 4 2008, 12:02 PM']Thanks Birdy but a bit out of my price range. Good luck selling it though.

Does anyone know what the Hartke VX115 speaker is like? Its a paper cone, can handle 300W at 8 ohms and is only £165. My other option is the Hartke 115 XL but this is only 200W at 8 ohms.

Would Hartke be a better option that Ashdown?[/quote]
The Hartke VX115 is solidly built, but not overweight, and when I auditioned it, it sounded warmer and cleaner than a second hand 1 by 15 H&K or a second hand 1 by 15 Peavey for the same kind of money. It takes a low B without problems, and does not seem to suffer from the boom of a big speaker in a small box that you will hear from some smaller combos.

I used it in a church and occasional outdoor gigs (without PA support) and never ran out of volume. The only time I did run out of volume was at an audition in an empty club, where the lead guitarist had a large amp, and I only had 200 watts to play with.

I stopped using it when I finished building a BFM Omni 12 (£250-ish for the parts + 30 hours work). You might be interested in buying my Hartke if we can work out a way of getting it from Warrington to Surrey without adding 25% to the cost.

[Jack]

[quote name='tombboy' post='144568' date='Feb 21 2008, 06:08 PM']IIRC it's not about the watts.... more about spl's. An crease of 3db is effectively double the volume and would require roughly double the wattage of your amp to achieve this if cranked.
I'll try to put this another way...
If your 300 watt amp is cranked and measuring 130db at 1 metre, to double the volume you would need a six hundred watt amp (and the speakers to match) to achieve 133db at 1 metre.
I think thats correct.... correct ME if I'm wrong!!


As for amp choice... good advice about going for the most expensive you can afford to your ears. My choice would be Markbass, obviously.[/quote]

10db is double the sound pressure. 'Volume' (whatever that is) is very subjective, and cant really be measured.

Youre right that (all else being equal) it takes double the power to increase by 3db. And the other guy is right that 10x the power should increase the sound pressure by +10db. But 10db is double the sound pressure level, not 3.


To the OP, Id find it very hard to recommend anything less that a pretty big cab (2x12" or a 4x10" or whatever) and at least 500W. BUT I gigged with a MAG410 combo (sometimes but rarely with a 1x15 MAG ext cab) for over a year and I never really ran out of steam on the pub scene. Im doing more varied (and usually bigger) things now and Im not sure the combo by itself would cope.

[johnnylager]

I've had an Ashdown ABM EVO II 210 combo with an ABM 210 cab for a while now and it's not too heavy, even with my f##cked back. Nice sound and loud enough for most gigs that don't have a decent PA. The more speakers the better.

Both fit on the back seat of a Focus together, leaving the boot free to lock your drummer / guitarist / singer in (edit as appropriate). Make sure they've been to the toilet and you've taken their lighters off 'em first, though.

Edited February 27, 2008 by johnnylager

[Linus27]

Thanks for all the info everyone. Found it very helpful.

However, I am a little surprised at something. You all seem to be saying that the Ashdown MAG-C115-300 will only be giving out about 180 watts. I was of the understanding that it gives out 307 watts. Is it only giving out 180 watts because its running at 8 Ohms on its own and if I connect another speaker to it then it goes up to the 307 watts running at 4 Ohms?? Can someone just set this straight for me as if this is correct then I am not going for this.

If so, then I might as well go for either a Hartke 3500 or Hartke 5000 through either a Hartke VX410 4 x 10 or a VX115 1 x 15.

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Linus27' post='167317' date='Mar 31 2008, 10:17 PM']Thanks for all the info everyone. Found it very helpful.

However, I am a little surprised at something. You all seem to be saying that the Ashdown MAG-C115-300 will only be giving out about 180 watts. I was of the understanding that it gives out 307 watts. Is it only giving out 180 watts because its running at 8 Ohms on its own and if I connect another speaker to it then it goes up to the 307 watts running at 4 Ohms?? Can someone just set this straight for me as if this is correct then I am not going for this.

If so, then I might as well go for either a Hartke 3500 or Hartke 5000 through either a Hartke VX410 4 x 10 or a VX115 1 x 15.[/quote]

Yes, to get the full output you need either another 8 ohms cab or to connect it to a 4ohms cab. I think its nearer 220watts though.

[OldGit]

Linus27,
What's your budget for your amplification?

Oh and you get a lot more bang for your buck is you buy used.

[Linus27]

OldGit

I was looking at maybe between £300 and £400 and I think this will be for used gear. At the moment, top of my list is the Hartke 3500. I just can't decide if I should go for a Hartke 1 x 15 or a Hartke 4 x 10. I am tempted to go for the 1 x 15 as I like more a driving bigger sound and if I need more treble then I can get a 2 x 10 later on.

[nottswarwick]

Very good choice with the 3500 Hartke. I had one in the past and it was great. I dont think you would regret buying one for the money.

My choice would be a 4*10, but this is where it is up to your ears to decide. I just think the 4*10 is a better "single cab" option than a 15".

[Linus27]

Thanks for the advice nottswarwick.

[OldGit]

Both a 1x15 and a 4x10 will have punch and cut. A 1x15 has a certain sound though ..
You should have no problem gettinga used 300 watter for that budget.

You will need 300 watts with an enthusiastic drummer though. Anything smaller will struggle a bit and it's better to find you have too much than not enough.

[friend2talk2]

[quote name='Linus27' post='130680' date='Jan 30 2008, 03:18 PM']I am getting back into playing and may end up joining a band which I guess may lead to gigs at some point.

What sort of size amp combo would be suitable for pubs and small clubs? I have been looking at the Ashdown MAG-C115-300 Pre Amp Combo but its 300W so is this a bit overkill?? They also do the
Ashdown EB 15-180 Combo but thats only 180W so will that be underpowered? The prices are good at around £200 to £250 and I may even be able to get discount through a friend.

Its just what sort or power rating do I want. Also, no idea if Ashdown are any good.

Any advice really appreciated. Thanks[/quote]

I love using the Fender pro 400 with 115pro ext the combo has 2-10" & ext has 1-15" the 2 produce 500watts with a great punch & having all that power is way more than what I need however I'm always sure to have enough balls when I need it

[thinman]

Linus27 - I know you were considering an Ashdown MAG300 C115.

I've got one and as a bread and butter amp it's been pretty good and even without an extension cab I found I could keep up with our drummer OK (in fact we mic his bass drum and stick that through the PA) and he's got quite a decent loud Sonor kit.

However, I've recently built a Bill Fitzmaurice Omni 10 which is a horn loaded 2 x 10" with 4 piezo horns. That cost me about £220 to build but that includes 2 good quality Eminence Neodynium drivers of the sort of quality you probably won't get in a commercially produced cab for twice that cost.

I then bought a rather old but perfectly working Hughes & Kettner Bassbase 250 head (from Warwickhunt who frequents this forum) for £125. That can put out 250w into the 4 ohm Omni 10 (which can handle up to 500w). The Omni 10 is very efficient so you get plenty of SPL per watt. That is a big factor as has been mentioned in previous postings - it's not totally about power.

I now think that for about £345 I've got a really nice set up. I don't know if you would consider a build your own cab but it's a good option if you feel able and there's good heads to be had for reasonable money.

What struck me most though is the bass response from the Omni 10. When I first bought the MAG combo I plumped for the 1 x 15" because it seemed to have more bottom - I didn't like the 2 x 10" version as much. However, the Omni10 seems to have far more bottom end (maybe just perceptually) than the Ashdown 1 x 15" and a Trace Elliott 1 x 15" that I borrowed recently. Some of this may be due to the tone of the H&K amp which has a valve pre-amp that must impart some nice tonal quality.

So, use your ears when deciding on a cab. My experience here is that it's not always true that a 1 x 15" will have more bottom that a 2 x 10" - there's too many other factors.

Mike

PS My Ashdown's going up for sale now. The transformer blew but Ashdown fixed that - I think you've seen the thread. I wouldn't make a salesman would I?

[OldGit]

[quote name='thinman' post='168726' date='Apr 2 2008, 08:23 PM']Linus27 - I know you were considering an Ashdown MAG300 C115.

I've got one and as a bread and butter amp it's been pretty good and even without an extension cab I found I could keep up with our drummer OK (in fact we mic his bass drum and stick that through the PA) and he's got quite a decent loud Sonor kit.

However, I've recently built a Bill Fitzmaurice Omni 10 which is a horn loaded 2 x 10" with 4 piezo horns. That cost me about £220 to build but that includes 2 good quality Eminence Neodynium drivers of the sort of quality you probably won't get in a commercially produced cab for twice that cost.

I then bought a rather old but perfectly working Hughes & Kettner Bassbase 250 head (from Warwickhunt who frequents this forum) for £125. That can put out 250w into the 4 ohm Omni 10 (which can handle up to 500w). The Omni 10 is very efficient so you get plenty of SPL per watt. That is a big factor as has been mentioned in previous postings - it's not totally about power.

I now think that for about £345 I've got a really nice set up. I don't know if you would consider a build your own cab but it's a good option if you feel able and there's good heads to be had for reasonable money.

What struck me most though is the bass response from the Omni 10. When I first bought the MAG combo I plumped for the 1 x 15" because it seemed to have more bottom - I didn't like the 2 x 10" version as much. However, the Omni10 seems to have far more bottom end (maybe just perceptually) than the Ashdown 1 x 15" and a Trace Elliott 1 x 15" that I borrowed recently. Some of this may be due to the tone of the H&K amp which has a valve pre-amp that must impart some nice tonal quality.

So, use your ears when deciding on a cab. My experience here is that it's not always true that a 1 x 15" will have more bottom that a 2 x 10" - there's too many other factors.

Mike

PS My Ashdown's going up for sale now. The transformer blew but Ashdown fixed that - I think you've seen the thread. I wouldn't make a salesman would I?[/quote]


Doesn't someone on here build Omni's for people?

[Huge Hands]

Linus,

I have the MAG300 210 combo, which is the same head, but 2x10's instead. I bought a 115 extension cab (the speaker in the combo you mention?)

I have rarely used the 115. I find the 2x10 is fine for the pub gigs I play (up to around 300 people?), and I never have to turn it up full, or overdrive it.

Although we mainly do blues/soul, we used to regularly do 4-band nights on the indie scene in London, so all sorts of emo/punk/thrash bands would use it as the night wore on. I have had no complaints or problems with it, other than losing one of the control knobs.

My only complaint is with the knobs on it, there is no centering on the EQ cut/boost pots, and the knobs twist with very little resistance - i.e. I was once playing a gig with a very small stage in an eight piece band. All of a sudden my bass got VERY loud - I had managed to turn it up with the back of my leg! (We were that squished!)

Not a big thing though if you expect it - I am really happy with my rig. My combo and extra bin cost me about £600 around 4 and a half years ago - I think I saw Rusty Shackleford sell the same setup but with a separate head for about £260 the lot on here recently. Bargain!

I wish I had done that (combo was cheaper than separates when I bought mine). The 210 combo is pretty heavy!

[Huge Hands]

Speak of the devil....

[topic="0"]Ashdown 210 combo for sale[/topic]

EDIT: Can't get the link to work. Someone's selling a 210 for under £200 in the Amp and Cabs forum.

Edited April 3, 2008 by Huge Hands

[thinman]

[quote name='OldGit' post='168920' date='Apr 3 2008, 10:43 AM']Doesn't someone on here build Omni's for people?[/quote]

A chap called Thumper was an official builder. Not sure if he still is though. I think official builders are listed on www.billfitzmaurice.com and probably some on finnbass.com. Check the "Where can I hear a BFM cab" thread.

IIRC an Omni10 of a similar spec to mine is about £400 built.

[tauzero]

[quote name='OldGit' post='168920' date='Apr 3 2008, 10:43 AM']Doesn't someone on here build Omni's for people?[/quote]
There's [url="http://www.arrowheadguitars.co.uk/basscabs.html"]Arrowhead Guitars[/url] which is Paul_C who has just started up doing them.

[OldGit]

[quote name='tauzero' post='169130' date='Apr 3 2008, 02:16 PM']There's [url="http://www.arrowheadguitars.co.uk/basscabs.html"]Arrowhead Guitars[/url] which is Paul_C who has just started up doing them.[/quote]
Cheers

[elom]

[quote name='Huge Hands' post='168956' date='Apr 3 2008, 10:18 AM']Linus,

I have the MAG300 210 combo, which is the same head, but 2x10's instead. I bought a 115 extension cab (the speaker in the combo you mention?)

I have rarely used the 115. I find the 2x10 is fine for the pub gigs I play (up to around 300 people?), and I never have to turn it up full, or overdrive it.

Although we mainly do blues/soul, we used to regularly do 4-band nights on the indie scene in London, so all sorts of emo/punk/thrash bands would use it as the night wore on. I have had no complaints or problems with it, other than losing one of the control knobs.[/quote]

Exactly the same experience for me (even down to losing one of the knobs, which Ashdown replaced). I have never had to use the extension cab for a gig yet, in fact I've been thinking about selling it. I bought both 2nd hand through these forums about 12 months ago - paid £150 for the combo and £100 for the cab. Definitely try and go 2nd hand if you can.

I recently tried out a Markbass combo and it was in a completely different league. However I can't justify spending that sort of money and for the gigs I do (and my standard of play!) the Ashdown MAG stuff is just fine.

[Linus27]

Thanks so far for the help everyone.

I have got the offer of an Ashdown 300Mag bass amp and 4 x 10 at a very good price. Should I go for it or hold out and get a Harke 3500 amp??

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='Linus27' post='169634' date='Apr 4 2008, 09:41 AM']Thanks so far for the help everyone.

I have got the offer of an Ashdown 300Mag bass amp and 4 x 10 at a very good price. Should I go for it or hold out and get a Harke 3500 amp??[/quote]

Personally i would go with the Ashdown. Mainly because i have one and have been very happy with it.

[ReeV0]

for pubs and clubs, i would go for either:

Warwick Sweet 25.1
Fender Bassman 250/210
Peavey TNT115
Marshall MB4410

[Linus27]

I decided not to get the Ashdown stuff as the more I read about the MAG models, the more problems I keep reading people have. Anything from the blue speaker cones not being up to the job or the amp head needing repairs always.

So I have decided to go with the following,

Hartke HA3500 amp 350 Watts @ 8 Ohms/240 Watts @ 4 Ohms
Hartke VX115 speaker 300 Watts @ 8 Ohms
Hartke VX210 speaker 200 Watts @ 8 Ohms

Can I just check one thing though. If I connect both those speakers into the amp, will that turn them into 4 Ohms and so I will get the full 350 watts from the amp or will they stay at 8 Ohms and I only get the 240 watts??

Thanks again for any help.