niceguyhomer Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 I'm going through the process of changing my rig at the moment and I borrowed a Yamaha PS5000 power amp and an Epifani UL310 the other night for a gig. I used my EBS Microbass II for the preamp got one of the best, tightest, punchiest bass sounds I've ever had. I've decided I want to go down this route now rather than buy a new head because I love the tones I get with the EBS and want the flexibility a power amp offers (ohm-wise) when choosing and using different cabs. I've read great things about the Yammy power amps and they're relatively inexpensive but I don't think this particular amp was quite powerful enough. We were only doing a fairly small pub and I had the amp running at about 80% which makes me wonder about buying the next model up - the PS7000 for the extra headroom it'd give me. Before I do, has anyone got any advice / suggestions / recommendations for other amps etc. because I know very little about power amps. Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 Crown Xti 1000, fantastic, and the fans only come on when they get really hot, so they're ideal for quiet gigs or at home practicing. Very powerful and very reasonably priced. [url="http://www.crownaudio.com/amp_htm/xti.htm"]http://www.crownaudio.com/amp_htm/xti.htm[/url] Did I mention that they're also very light. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 Hey chap! to be honest.. I'd check to make sure the EBS microbass is able to supply enough signal to drive the poweramp effectively. (true line level output, that is) I used to use a P5000 in a metal band and had enough volume. (Used an Ampeg SVP to drive it) The Yammy amps are great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted December 31, 2007 Author Share Posted December 31, 2007 [quote name='dood' post='111498' date='Dec 31 2007, 02:20 PM']Hey chap! to be honest.. I'd check to make sure the EBS microbass is able to supply enough signal to drive the poweramp effectively. (true line level output, that is) I used to use a P5000 in a metal band and had enough volume. (Used an Ampeg SVP to drive it) The Yammy amps are great.[/quote] Thanks Dood, will you have a look at this (EBS Microbass II spec) and tell me if it's ok... Technical Specifications: Nominal Input Level - 8 dBv Input Impedance 10 Mohms (Ch A), 1 Mohms (Ch Output Impedance 10 kohms Frequency Response +0 / -3 dB 20 - 20k Hz Tone Controls Bass +/- 15 dB @ 100 Hz Treble +/- 15 dB @ 10 kHz shelving Bright + 12 dB @ 10 kHz,15dB gain Midrange +/- 12 dB, 50 –2.000 Hz ,Q=0.80 Edge +/- 12 dB @ 7 kHz Boost Control Gain 0 – 30 dB Drive Control Gain 0 – 35 dB Dynamic Range typ 107 dB A-weighted Dimensions (L x W x H) 4.3” x 6.0” x 2.3” (110 x 153 x 58 mm) Weight 875g (1.95 lb.) Power Requirements 9 V DC Regulated, 10 mA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 The EBS MicroBass v1 manual suggests an max output of 9dBv - but the v2 doesnt say. I wonder if this is the prob. On a related note, I took my Epi cab, power amp.. EQ rack and EBS compressor out last night for a jam and also had some remarkable tone results! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted December 31, 2007 Author Share Posted December 31, 2007 It's all Klingon to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 [quote name='niceguyhomer' post='111500' date='Dec 31 2007, 02:27 PM']Thanks Dood, will you have a look at this (EBS Microbass II spec) and tell me if it's ok... Technical Specifications: Nominal Input Level - 8 dBv Input Impedance 10 Mohms (Ch A), 1 Mohms (Ch Output Impedance 10 kohms Frequency Response +0 / -3 dB 20 - 20k Hz Tone Controls Bass +/- 15 dB @ 100 Hz Treble +/- 15 dB @ 10 kHz shelving Bright + 12 dB @ 10 kHz,15dB gain Midrange +/- 12 dB, 50 –2.000 Hz ,Q=0.80 Edge +/- 12 dB @ 7 kHz Boost Control Gain 0 – 30 dB Drive Control Gain 0 – 35 dB Dynamic Range typ 107 dB A-weighted Dimensions (L x W x H) 4.3” x 6.0” x 2.3” (110 x 153 x 58 mm) Weight 875g (1.95 lb.) Power Requirements 9 V DC Regulated, 10 mA[/quote] in addition to my previous post.. I think some poweramps do infact need a bit more signal to drive them as well. So, if you have a low output preamp connected to a poweramp that needs a hotter signal to drive it... the net result is less output from the amp. I think it'd be a disaster if said gear was then plugged into a cab with a very low sensitivity, like an ACME for example!! Are you able to try that set up again? maybe with a different preamp? Last night I had the set up:- BASS>Multicomp>EQ rack>Poweramp>Epifani cab. I really had to boost the output of the EQ to drive the amp. This was because I was running at 'instrument level' and had to boost the output up to 'line level' for my poweramp. This is why I suspect you are having the same problems. Funny how we were both using*almost* the same set up!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 [quote name='niceguyhomer' post='111502' date='Dec 31 2007, 02:31 PM']It's all Klingon to me [/quote] Ha ha! Sorry mate! Hopefully my last post will make a bit more sense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted December 31, 2007 Author Share Posted December 31, 2007 Getting a bit clearer thanks. I did have a plan to buy a decent preamp at a later stage but can't really justify the outlay at the moment when I'm buying a power amp & cabs too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 Oh and my top tip for the Yamaha P series poweramps, for bass guitar:- *Turn on the High Pass Filter on both channels. *Wind the frequency control all the way down to minimum (25Hz) There's no point trying to get the cab to produce frequencies it can't and this serious guards against speaker farting and over excursion due to excessive bass frequencies. I can't comment on how effective it is on other poweramps.. but this is a tried and tested method. You won't hear any difference in bottom end either, only less flapping about ;o) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 [quote name='niceguyhomer' post='111508' date='Dec 31 2007, 02:39 PM']Getting a bit clearer thanks. I did have a plan to buy a decent preamp at a later stage but can't really justify the outlay at the moment when I'm buying a power amp & cabs too.[/quote] I can't see the Yammy being a bad choice to be honest. I guess it doesn't hurt to have the extra headroom of say the P7500.. and it's still not an expensive amp, especially if you purchased from soundslive.co.uk - I think they are one of the cheapest (well actually.. it was when I'd bought mine.. mebbe there are other outlets doing great prices too!) Get ya laughin gear round one of these:- [url="http://www.bkelec.com/Pro/Amplifiers/MXF1200D.htm"]http://www.bkelec.com/Pro/Amplifiers/MXF1200D.htm[/url] Independent switch mode power supplies (one per channel) Power ratings R.M.S. with both channels driven Presence and clip indication Neutrik Combi Input Connections Neutrik Speakon Output Connectors Compact Lightweight Cool Blue illuminations R.M.S. Watts into 4 Ohms 600 Per Channel R.M.S. Watts into 8 Ohms 300 Per Channel 3dB Power Bandwidth 2Hz - 22Khz Full Power t.h.d. 0.1% Input Sensitivity 775mV Input Impedance 7.5K Ohms S/N Ratio 85dB Power Requirements - Supply 240V AC 50 - 60Hz [b]Weight 8Kg [/b] Size - Front Panel 19" (482.6mm) x (1U) Size - Depth 376 mm £469.95 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted December 31, 2007 Share Posted December 31, 2007 ok last post for now... if you can find an EBS Classic preamp (V1) They are awesome! - but cost a fortune! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted January 1, 2008 Author Share Posted January 1, 2008 Thanks Dood - that MXF1200D looks interesting. I've had a gander at Basstasters too and I really like the sound of the Ampeg SVP-CL preamp. May sell a bass (don't need 3) and invest it in my rig. We'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 1, 2008 Share Posted January 1, 2008 Try the Crown XTi it really is good, I'm a very fussy so and so when it comes to gear, I hate noisy stuff that messes up my sound, the XTi100 is only £399 from Soundcontrol. [url="http://www.soundcontrol.co.uk/mod_1/pages/mod_1.12/pages/mod_1.12.1/pages/mod_1.12.1.1/pages/index.php?sku=1.1.6.2-114-19"]http://www.soundcontrol.co.uk/mod_1/pages/...=1.1.6.2-114-19[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted January 1, 2008 Author Share Posted January 1, 2008 [quote name='6stringbassist' post='111838' date='Jan 1 2008, 03:44 PM']Try the Crown XTi it really is good, I'm a very fussy so and so when it comes to gear, I hate noisy stuff that messes up my sound, the XTi100 is only £399 from Soundcontrol. [url="http://www.soundcontrol.co.uk/mod_1/pages/mod_1.12/pages/mod_1.12.1/pages/mod_1.12.1.1/pages/index.php?sku=1.1.6.2-114-19"]http://www.soundcontrol.co.uk/mod_1/pages/...=1.1.6.2-114-19[/url][/quote] I've seen a lot written about these amps and it's all good but on paper, it has less power than the Yammy. Maybe I should ditch the idea of using the EBS as a preamp and look for something with a higher output or maybe consider using more cones to get the volume I need. Thanks for the tip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 1, 2008 Share Posted January 1, 2008 The XTi2000 is only £549. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 You don't need more power than that Yamaha, in fact I'm sure you could have much less and never run out of headroom. You need more gain and that requires a more sensitive power amp and/or a hotter preamp. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmyC Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Three really good preamps for sale on the forum atm: Demeter - [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=10548"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=10548[/url] SWR and Eden - [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=10578"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=10578[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted January 2, 2008 Author Share Posted January 2, 2008 Thanks Timmy, I've been offered two of them already Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 One of them's mine. It sounds fantastic with the Crown power amp through a pair of Accugrooves, plenty of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 [quote name='niceguyhomer' post='112181' date='Jan 2 2008, 11:33 AM']Thanks Timmy, I've been offered two of them already [/quote] I'd toyed earlier this year with the idea of getting a rack channel strip and use that as a preamp. I'd have to see if my post is still here (or it may have been on BassTalk - bad memory!!) - There's a few guys on here who use one. I have to admit that your thread has had me pulling my rack apart yet again. I really have a problem! I wish I could just be happy with what I have!! I wonder if my issue is that I am yet to find an amp that does exactly what I need! One of these days I will sit down and build one myself through frustration!!! Anyway, back to the rack strips.. I liked the spec of the ART Pro Channel and similar units, but I think I'd want a 1u. To Include a compressor and a decent EQ section/ parametric. I found this link with some info on, just a moment ago: [url="http://www.digitalprosound.com/2001/08_aug/features/ch_strip/ch_strip.htm"]http://www.digitalprosound.com/2001/08_aug...ip/ch_strip.htm[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dood Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Ahhh here's the thread I was talking about [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=1896&hl=channel+strip"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...l=channel+strip[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 Isn't that what Anthony Jackson uses, he has a Millenia something or other and a Meyer (I think) power amp. I keep going backwards and forwards between a valve pre, and just using my Lexicon Mpx1 through my power amp, it produces plenty of volume, and the EQ is excellent, it has a few EQ patches, I use a 3 band parametric and I've copied that to some reverb and modulation effects. I've got an Alembic F1-X that sounds nice when it decides to work, and the Demeter that really is superb, I'm also getting a Kern, that's been described as being an Alembic on steroids. I'd prefer to sell the Alembic, but as I say it's very temperamental in its attitude to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6stringbassist Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 That's what I hate about sites like this, you're nice and happy with your set up and sound etc, then someone goes and throws a spanner in the works and posts a link like that...only joking, that thread on channel strips is really interesting, thanks for posting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassman7 Posted January 2, 2008 Share Posted January 2, 2008 [quote name='6stringbassist' post='112254' date='Jan 2 2008, 01:10 PM']That's what I hate about sites like this, you're nice and happy with your set up and sound etc, then someone goes and throws a spanner in the works and posts a link like that...only joking, that thread on channel strips is really interesting, thanks for posting it.[/quote] Ed Straker says: "An analysis of your equipment list confirms you appreciate high quality products. Another spanner, if I may, in the works - have you considered the preamps and power amps from probably one of the pre-eminent solid state bass amplification specialists in Germany, Glockenklang; if you are looking at Kern, Demeter et al then Glock products should really be on your short list." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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