Leaderboard

So you can do it quickly silently at a gig. There's nothing more irritating or amateur than the tuning song.

I always liked the sound of my bass through a PA anyway, in fact bass straight into the desk is probably my favourite bass tone! Pros and cons of swapping an amp out for an FRFR (for me anyway) are as follows: Pros - Can carry the entire thing with one hand. - Loads of better placement options on stage especially if you're tall, points at your head and can be put anywhere down to small size. - Sounds similar to what the audience hear, a clear representation of my bass. - Works very well with existing DI/EQ pedals and pedalboards. - Was £100 better off after selling my bass amp. - Takes up much less space in the house. - Set up in a couple of minutes. Cons - Doesn't look as nice as my old Markbass rig. I can't emphasize the placement part enough, I've always struggled with hearing myself due to being tall which was corrected when I got the MarkBass Club cabs as they tilt back. However that posed a new problem as I either had to find space where I could have 3ft of bass cabs on the floor or have one on top of the other in a wedge position. The small size of the QSC completely eliminates this, it fits in between the legs of our lights stand so even on a tiny stage there is always room for it, I can have it at the front of stage pointing back and it doesn't look out of place too. Worth noting that my amp is purely for stage monitoring, we have a decent RCF PA which does all the donkey work and I was using compact DI/EQ boxes like the Fishman and MXR M80 to DI directly without any amp sims. Swapping my amp out for an FRFR was the logical step for me, should have done it years ago.

Gorgeous looking bass, haven't tried one for sound though. Here's mine ;-)

Bristol, 2011 The last audition I had was for a band that the drummer who was in my jazz band had joined about six months previously. The band had regular gigs but didn't have a bass player up to that point as there 'wasn't enough money to pay a fourth person'. Anyway, they wanted a double bass player and the drummer wanted me in the band so he booked a local rehearsal space and the singer/guitarist drove the 60 miles from his home to Bristol for the occasion (which he moaned about all the way through the audition). I'd learnt the songs from the album the band had just recorded - it was pretty easy as there was no bass on the album, so I could just do what I wanted and it was all Johnny Cash style G/C/D stuff. Easy peasy. The singer/frontman bailed out of the session half an hour before it was due to start as he'd forgotten he was supposed to be playing football. No problem says drummer, the guitarist can sing the other guys parts. The audition got underway and everything seemed good to me. The drummer was mostly playing along with the guitar as that's the sound they had evolved without a bass player, but the drummer and I had been playing jazz together for the past three years so I wasn't bothered about having to play along to a non-standard drum part. The guitarist wasn't happy though..... when the drummer asked him how he felt it was going, all he could say was 'I dunno - it's not what I was expecting'. Further questioning from the drummer revealed that he actually didn't know what to expect as he'd only ever done solo stuff and had never played in an actual band before this one and had never played with a bass player before. No problem says the drummer, we'll have a proper rehearsal next week, before the next gig with singer/frontman and we'll see how much better it is. Fast forward to next weeks rehearsal, the frontman/singer bails again because he has a hangover... so we go ahead anyway and rehearse the set. Drummer is happy, I'm reasonably happy but guitarist still doesn't know if I sound like he thinks he wants it to sound, even though he can't explain to me what that sound is. He's also demonstrating an alarming tendency to be unable to remember which key the songs should be in. Drummer reckons we're all sorted for the gig next week. I'm less convinced. Alarm bells should be ringing - I've not yet met this flaky singer/frontman who I'll meet for the first time at the gig next week and the guitarist is still being very non-committal about whether I'm in the band or not. it's only my faith in the drummer and his insistence that 'everything will be cool' that I'm not walking away - but it's not looking good from my perspective The gig comes round and I meet the singer/frontman for the first time. He's actually a pretty cool bloke and apologises for not being at the audition/rehearsal, but admits that as he's never been in a band with a bass player before, he would have no idea if I was any good or not and therefore would have no meaningful input to make. Fair enough really. The gig goes pretty well, the band's fans say they love the addition of bass, so I'm in if I want it..... 7 years later I'm still in this band. we do 60+ gigs a year and have released four albums. Not all auditions from hell end up staying in hell. The original guitarist is gone though - he whinged one too many times about having to drive to Bristol for 2 gigs and two rehearsals a year.

I think a lot of people are thinking these FRFR cabs are just like the crappy old tops they've got lying around.

Here's Rhino Edwards using his set along side Jim Kirkpatrick's at the Shepherds Bush Empire in January: Rhino's Revenge. They were guests of King King. Plenty of photos of Alan Nimmo using his Smooth Hound wireless here. There's many more professionals using the set all over the world on big stages and small.

The sound through the on stage monitor may not be identical to the sound out front but provided it’s of comparable quality to the rest of your PA it’ll get you much closer than the typical coloured bass cab will. As with most things you tend to get what you pay for, so there’s no use expecting a dirt cheap monitor to match up sound-wise to a multi-thousand pound PA projecting out front, or vice versa. And of course, even if your on stage monitor is the same make and model as your PA tops, the characteristics of the room will affect the sound out front to some degree. If you’re playing at a smaller venue then the tone coming out of your monitor (now serving as backline) is what the audience is also hearing. Simples Granted, using “house” stage monitors and PA might throw a spanner in the works as you’re at the mercy of whatever they give you. For me I guess it’s just about eliminating variables. I’ve always preferred to have all my tone shaping from my basses and pedals. In that sense, me and the rest of the converts in this thread are certainly in the minority of bassists as a whole. However, I will say that since more and more pro bassists and pro guitarists (the kind who play truly massive venues and do national/international tours) are running amp modellers into FRFR monitors or in ears that there’s probably some method to our madness. Consistency of sound from venue to venue, ease of setup/tear down, cleaning up of the stage space and making the sound guy/gal’s job easier out front. Very few of us in this thread are at that level of gigging but clearly we still feel the advantages even though we’re only playing in our bedrooms or down at the Dog & Duck. Also, bear in mind that everyone here who is now happily living the FRFR life has had experience owning and playing through traditional amps and cabs, and having compared the two experiences are finding the monitor route to be better for them. I’d say that it’s easy to be a skeptic from afar with no meaningful experience of the very thing being criticised. You just have to try both to be able to form a balanced argument on the matter. @stingrayPete1977‘s comments above are totally accurate. These RCFs will stand toe to toe with bass rigs of the same driver size and win every time for both volume and heft. I’d challenge you, @Al Krow, to see about trialling one as a replacement for your backline. Use it for a couple of rehearsals and a couple of gigs (giving you a little time to dial in the kind of sound you like) and then come back here and share how you feel. You may still prefer the look of a “proper bass amp” sitting behind you but I can bet money that you’ll have changed your tune with regards to their performance. p.s. Oh, and since you have a Zoom MS-60b and B3n you can even emulate your current Markbass sound and get rid of some of the subjectivity of the tone argument! It’ll be a test purely of volume, heft and dispersion. p.p.s. And convenience, of course.

If I was playing in a band like that I'd have light-weight fold-flat Ampeg SVT and Fridge façade to go in front of my FRFR.

I spent 28yrs of a 30yr playing career with no pedals. Recently I have been using them. They are fun to have but not essential. They do sound good though. The best improvement to your sound is practice though.

Voice coil size is just one way of seeing through the exaggerated claims made by manufacturers of audio gear. As the technology currently stands, a 2" coil should handle up to 200W, a 2.5" coil up to 300W and a 3" coil between 350 and 500W. There are other factors involved apart from voice coil diameter, but I wouldn't be confident using anything smaller than 2.5" (unless it's in multiples) for bass backline. Your TKS 112 has a 2.5" coil, by the way, Funkshui. (I'm talking bass drivers here, not compression drivers)

Small one for my usual shop but can downsize to a basket if I'm just nipping in for a few minutes.

And then worked with George Martin who DID study music. The 'music theory stunts your creativity ' argument is a justification. Any knowledge empowers you. A lack of knowledge will not improve creativity, it will be irrelevant to it.

Wow! Not many folk can say that about their bass - what a lovely part of its story.

Oh that looks nice

Finished!! Well not quite, I haven’t installed the electrics or wired it up yet, but everything is together now and it’s looking awesome! I’ll replace the temporary strap buttons with Schaller strap locks, put on the string retainer and the tug bar once it’s strung. It’s the lightest Precision bass (or any bass for that matter) I’ve ever played. At just 6.5 lb it’s 3 whole lb lighter than my Fender Jazz, my shoulder says ‘yay!’ Looking forward to getting some flatwounds on it and seeing how it sounds!! Very pleased 🍊

I am truly gutted that I had nothing to offer this thread. Not had any experience even close to any of these so just a big thank you to all the contributors. This is pure gold .................

...about your band. Apologies if this has been covered in other topics but I searched and couldn't find anything. I'll start things off with a few... Our male singer never turns up for rehearsals (it's his band and he books most of the gigs...) The band spend hours practicing a new song at the rehearsal the singer never turned up for to play at a gig the following weekend then the singer decides he doesn't want to sing it because he hasn't rehearsed it... During every gig our drummer always asks "what's the next song?" despite everybody having a printed set list (which is more or less the same every time) and he's supposed to start most of the songs... Our lead guitarist always plays a bit of the next song before we start it - he says it's so he can remember the key - which means every gig is like "name that tune"... Our female singer sits drinking a bottle of white wine playing sudoku before each gig whilst we're setting all the gear up... She sometimes drinks too much white wine and forgets where she is in songs and sings the chorus during verses and vice versa (not helped by being as blind as a bat but refusing to wear her glasses so she can't read her songbook...) Our rhythm guitarist has the most expensive gear in the world (Taylor acoustic, AER amp, PRS custom electric) but still needs to read the chords off his iPad despite playing 75% of the same songs from when he started the band nine years ago... The bass player (me) strolls in 5 minutes before soundcheck and tries to sneak away as soon as the gig finishes to avoid helping with the PA and lights...!

My statement was in itself a blanket one, my bad. I was primarily referring to the comments re: these high end monitors being unable to consistently match (and indeed outperform) traditional bass rigs for heft/tone etc. when the components inside them mean that in fact they can - quite comfortably. Your other points are fair and valid! If I audition for a band any time soon and the name on the headstock of my bass stops me from getting the gig then I’m clearly auditioning for the wrong band. Either that or my playing stinks. Which will be the real reason for me not getting the gig

For some reason guitarists really do like MarkBass gear, I think the bright colour confuses them.

Btw - if you're auditioning for a band any time soon, take a Fender bass (or something that looks similar - I could lend you a pre 2015 Berg**) and something that looks like a bass amp (you could maybe borrow my Markbass combo - guitarists are always impressed by them). First impressions and all that ** actually bin the Berg. There was another very erudite thread recently and apparently you can do pretty much anything on a Squier bass and they are obviously a dead ringer for Fenders

Thought I'd contributed to this already but here we go, all scruffy photos however: 72 Telebass, Squier Japan 1994 P Bass and 2003 Japan reissue Blueflower P Bass

We have the RCF 735 cabs as tops, however they are full range and before we bought subs they handled a full 5 piece band with bass and keys without breaking a sweat. Serious full range sound at high volumes from two compact speakers, I don't think a band can do any better for £1.5k. I would be happy just using one as a FRFR cab on any stage I play, in fact you would barely get them ticking over. Trust me, most bass cabs won't touch a single 735 for low end at volume. The QSC I use is configurable to cross over at different frequencies (or not at all) as well as having DSP presets for different usage scenarios.

Does a bass cab really go lower than a good quality FRFR? It might look like it on paper, but you have to remember that most of what we perceive below 40Hz is implied by the harmonics being generated and not by the fundamental itself because most cabs simply aren't cable of reproducing these frequencies at any great volume. My Line6 Helix into a single RCF745 has replaced the huge Tech Soundsystems and EBS rig that I was previously using. With the RCF745 set up as a wedge the opportunities for positioning and dispersion on stage are superior to what I was getting previously which means lower on-stage volumes; and the new set up occupies about a quarter of the van space.

End grain will always stain darker than straight grain. It will even do that if you are simply clear varnishing plain wood due to the finish soaking in more into the grain pores where they are exposed. It's one of the reasons that the effect of flame maple is enhanced when you add the finish. I think you'll find that the effect looks pretty natural, though. I think I mentioned earlier that there's a stage in finishing where it really doesn't look great - hence the old advice of 'don't panic...it will be fine'

I think you are under estimating what the RCF speakers can do, massively! I've got a pair of RCF 735s, they'd demolish the Barefaced without breaking a sweat. It's s fairly simple to understand that a pair of cabs we use to amplify, drums, guitars, three vocal mics and my bass without the need for a sub or backline are going to have no trouble against a conventional bass amp if used purely as a bass amp monitor, there is no situation where a pair of RCF cabs should be maxed out when used as stage monitors anyway!

I tried to have a look at the forum, but I couldn't get in for all the toys thrown everywhere... dear me!

Just ordered one from Bax music slightly better price including delivery .

I too prefer to keep things as simple as possible at a gig. So much so that I now use combos so I don't even have the faff of separates with their associated cabling. Bass, lead, combo, done. I did use a preamp for a long time (outboard), but now I've got a Trace combo I eventually realised (like so many others before me) that time spent getting to know the Trace graphic EQ is very well spent. Turns out you can get pretty much any sound you can think of. No auxiliary preamp necessary.

one of these does the job for me. https://www.thomann.de/gb/millenium_go_kart_truck_xl.htm N

Just trying to set up the bass now and realised that the bridge is about 4/5mm out of alignment with the neck (I don’t quite know how that has happened I checked it 3 times) so I need to sort that out and shim the neck a little bit Here’s it all string up.......

I took lessons for 12-18mths when i first started and altho i'm not a sight reader by any means i have found it useful when learning songs. I use it more as a tool for learning rather than a requirement and i've played most styles of music over the years. Yes i could get by without it but it helps me, makes life easier for me anyway. With regards hand technique i started off correctly but have taken shortcuts that i found made playing some songs easier for me. Yep i'm lazy. I now have regrets that i didn't take it further tho as i am now catching up with chord patterns altho that's mainly for my own personal satisfaction. Anything you can learn is another way to improve in my book. Dave

-

A 2 ' square of 1" thick ply with biggish castors in the corners. A slot near one edge for picking it up.

oh dear - it appears to have rather caused a bit of a stir and i didn't even post anything

@Al Krow it's a Franz Sirius DC from Germany. Custom made for me and featuring a chestnut top taken from a tree felled in my parent's garden. I also use a fretless Franz. I used the wedge to tame the bottom end in what was a relatively small room with suspended wooden floor.

"That's a lovely rack tom." "Agreed, but don't call me Tom."

Looks great - and just like its twin. Great job

I might be able to, I’m near uttoxeter.

Yes Precision for me too Felt the Jazz and Ray had set up issue lots of fret noise more noticeable on all styles I Liked the T Bird handled all styles very well I always liked the Rick until got to played one and have hated them with a passion ever since, but though I should say slapped it had an edge i quite liked. Agree with DrT the Ray can handle more bass into that pickup position and did not show the heft / weight you can get out of these without the bloom Interesting. shame nobody give a shite what ya bass sounds like in the real world

These stories are brilliant. And you tell them beautifully, Mr Happy. I'd definitely enjoy reading a blog of this stuff. S.P.

Micro mixer?? I have a couple of these - ideal for when using a drum machine, etc.

Simplified things a little but very happy with this.

Interesting history to this bass. I bought it from Billy Lunn from the Subways. Charlotte Cooper played it on a couple of tracks on their first album before getting a Lakland deal. They bought it from Ian Broudie who produced their debut album. The Lightning Seeds bassist played it in the 90’s on TFI Friday at least 3 times including the famous performance of Three Lions with Skinner and Baddiel just after England were knocked out of Euro 96. Plays and sounds great, it is a 1980 with a poor quality neck joint, a random Coventry post code/serial number etched on the neck and random holes drilled on the front. However who cares for this level of mojo... Plus it still smells of smoke whatever I do to clean it...

Can't compete with the serious vintage stuff above, but I love my 1992 Jazz Aerodyne, and eyes are out on stalks every time I gig her :-)